Page 1 of 1
[8K] A good game for me
Posted: Fri Jun 17, 2011 10:39 am
by Tryphon
Here is a game I played against a OGS 2k (what, I think, is a little stronger than a KGS 2k).
It's an handicap game, I won it with no discussion, but I'd like it to be reviewed precisely because it's a game where I don't regret tons of moves, so my real defaults and profound misunderstandings on the game should appear clearly.
Thanks by advance
(;GM[1]FF[4]CA[UTF-8]AP[CGoban:3]ST[2]
RU[Japanese]SZ[19]HA[6]KM[1.00]
GN[OGS Honinbo 2011 (Handicap Class), Round 1 Group 14]PW[phoward]PB[tryphon]WR[3k]BR[10k]DT[2011-03-01,2011-06-13]CP[Creative Commons: Attribution-NonCommercial 3.0 Unported]GC[Game ID: 266716]EV[OGS Honinbo 2011 Handicap Class]RO[1]PC[Online Go.com:
http://www.online-go.com]AB[dd][pd][dj][pj][dp][pp]PL[W]
;W[fq]
;B[iq]
;W[dn]
;B[en]
;W[em]
;B[fn]
;W[cq]
;B[cp]
;W[dq]
;B[ep]
;W[fp]
;B[eq]
;W[er]
;B[fo]
;W[bp]
;B[bo]
;W[co]
;B[cn]
;W[do]
;B[eo]
;W[dm]
;B[bq]
;W[bn]
;B[ap]
;W[cm]
;B[gr]
;W[dg]
;B[fj]
;W[fc]
;B[ee]
;W[cc]
;B[cd]
;W[dc]
;B[ec]
;W[eb]
;B[ed]
;W[fg]
;B[gd]
;W[hg]
;B[id]
;W[bj]
;B[cj]
;W[bi]
;B[ch]
;W[cg]
;B[bh]
;W[dh]
;B[ci]
;W[ck]
;B[jg]
;W[he]
;B[gc]
;W[jf]
;B[kg]
;W[hi]
;B[jj]
;W[hk]
;B[fm]
;W[fl]
;B[gl]
;W[gk]
;B[fk]
;W[el]
;B[bf]
;W[bg]
;B[ag]
;W[bd]
;B[be]
;W[bc]
;B[kf]
;W[je]
;B[kc]
;W[hl]
;B[gm]
;W[qn]
;B[qo]
;W[pn]
;B[np]
;W[pl]
;B[qk]
;W[mm]
;B[mj]
;W[km]
;B[im]
;W[lp]
;B[nq]
;W[qc]
;B[qd]
;W[pc]
;B[oc]
;W[ob]
;B[nc]
;W[nb]
;B[mc]
;W[rd]
;B[re]
;W[rc]
;B[oe]
;W[ql]
;B[fb]
;W[da]
;B[nn]
;W[oj]
;B[oi]
;W[nj]
;B[ni]
;W[pk]
;B[qj]
;W[mk]
;B[lk]
;W[ml]
;B[lj]
;W[qq]
;B[ro]
;W[or]
;B[nr]
;W[oq]
;B[pq]
;W[pr]
;B[op]
;W[rq]
;B[lo]
;W[ko]
;B[ln]
;W[jl]
;B[kn]
;W[mb]
;B[il]
;W[jk]
;B[ik]
;W[rk]
;B[rj]
;W[rm]
;B[om]
;W[ol]
;B[nm]
;W[nl]
;B[sk]
;W[pm]
;B[rl]
;W[rn]
;B[os]
;W[sp]
;B[so]
;W[qs]
;B[gf]
;W[fi]
;B[ad]
;W[ac]
;B[dk]
;W[cl]
;B[lb]
;W[ld]
;B[hf]
;W[fa]
;B[gb]
;W[ij]
;B[gh]
;W[gg]
;B[gi]C[W resigns])
Re: [8K] A good game for me
Posted: Fri Jun 17, 2011 11:41 am
by Redundant
Tryphon wrote:Here is a game I played against a OGS 2k (what, I think, is a little stronger than a KGS 2k).
There's really no good way to compare OGS strength with KGS strength. For example, I'm about 4 or 5 kyu there because I don't put more than 30 seconds into any move.
Re: [8K] A good game for me
Posted: Sat Jun 18, 2011 10:43 pm
by Tryphon
bump, as said in this case

Re: [8K] A good game for me
Posted: Sat Jun 18, 2011 11:23 pm
by Redundant
No guarantees.
(;GM[1]FF[4]CA[UTF-8]AP[CGoban:3]ST[2]
RU[Japanese]SZ[19]HA[6]KM[1.00]
GN[OGS Honinbo 2011 (Handicap Class), Round 1 Group 14]PW[phoward]PB[tryphon]WR[3k]BR[10k]DT[2011-03-01,2011-06-13]CP[Creative Commons: Attribution-NonCommercial 3.0 Unported]GC[Game ID: 266716]EV[OGS Honinbo 2011 Handicap Class]RO[1]PC[Online Go.com: <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.online-go.com">http://www.online-go.com</a><!-- m -->]AB[dd][pd][dj][pj][dp][pp]PL[W]
;W[fq]
;B[iq]
;W[dn]
;B[en]
;W[em]
(;B[fn]C[Bad shape. See var]
;W[cq]
;B[cp]
;W[dq]
;B[ep]
;W[fp]
;B[eq]
;W[er]
;B[fo]
;W[bp]
;B[bo]
;W[co]
;B[cn]
;W[do]
;B[eo]
;W[dm]
;B[bq]
;W[bn]
;B[ap]
;W[cm]
;B[gr]
;W[dg]
;B[fj]
;W[fc]
;B[ee]
;W[cc]
;B[cd]
;W[dc]
(;B[ec]C[Aji keshi, see var]
;W[eb]
;B[ed]
;W[fg]
;B[gd]
;W[hg]
;B[id]
;W[bj]
;B[cj]
;W[bi]
(;B[ch]C[Probably better to get out.
]
;W[cg]
;B[bh]
;W[dh]
;B[ci]
;W[ck]
;B[jg]
;W[he]
;B[gc]
;W[jf]
;B[kg]
;W[hi]
(;B[jj]C[Pushing white toward a weak group.]
;W[hk]
;B[fm]
;W[fl]
;B[gl]
;W[gk]
;B[fk]
;W[el]
;B[bf]
;W[bg]
;B[ag]
;W[bd]
;B[be]
;W[bc]
(;B[kf]C[Forces white to make good shape]
;W[je]
;B[kc]
;W[hl]
;B[gm]
;W[qn]
;B[qo]
;W[pn]
;B[np]
;W[pl]
;B[qk]C[Good!]
;W[mm]
(;B[mj]
;W[km]
(;B[im]
;W[lp]
;B[nq]
;W[qc]
;B[qd]
;W[pc]
;B[oc]
;W[ob]
;B[nc]
;W[nb]
;B[mc]
;W[rd]
;B[re]
;W[rc]
(;B[oe]
;W[ql]
;B[fb]
;W[da]
;B[nn]
;W[oj]
;B[oi]
;W[nj]
;B[ni]
;W[pk]
;B[qj]
;W[mk]
;B[lk]
;W[ml]
;B[lj]
;W[qq]
;B[ro]
;W[or]
;B[nr]
;W[oq]
;B[pq]
;W[pr]
(;B[op]
;W[rq]
;B[lo]
;W[ko]
;B[ln]
;W[jl]
;B[kn]
;W[mb]
;B[il]
;W[jk]
;B[ik]
;W[rk]
;B[rj]
;W[rm]
;B[om]
;W[ol]
;B[nm]
;W[nl]
;B[sk]
;W[pm]
;B[rl]
;W[rn]
;B[os]
;W[sp]
;B[so]
;W[qs]
;B[gf]
;W[fi]
;B[ad]
;W[ac]
;B[dk]
;W[cl]
;B[lb]
;W[ld]
;B[hf]
;W[fa]
;B[gb]
;W[ij]
;B[gh]
;W[gg]
;B[gi]C[W resigns])
(;B[rq]
(;W[op]
;B[oo]
;W[po]
;B[qp])
(;W[rr]
;B[qp]
;W[qr]
;B[op]
;W[sq]
;B[rp]
;W[os]
;B[sr])
(;W[qr]
;B[op])))
(;B[qf]))
(;B[qc]))
(;B[km]C[I'd prefer to attack]))
(;B[le]))
(;B[hk]C[Attack from weak groups]))
(;B[hj]))
(;B[gd]))
(;B[eo]))
Re: [8K] A good game for me
Posted: Mon Jun 20, 2011 2:20 am
by Tryphon
Thank you ! Your shapes remarks are very enlightening for me !
Re: [8K] A good game for me
Posted: Mon Jun 20, 2011 12:36 pm
by Boyce
Is anybody allowed to ask questions about a game listed here? I know the main purpose of the forum is to help the player with reviews. But I have a question about move 5 and the shape variation Redundant posted...I can't see a difference between them to be honest

. Why is one shape better than they other in this case? It looked to me like the actual game he moved towards the center which I have been told is a good thing. I would feel like I was going to get stuck in the corner with the other extension.
Boyce
Re: [8K] A good game for me
Posted: Mon Jun 20, 2011 1:14 pm
by aurik
I would say it's questionable shape because of the presence of W @ F4: B can be cut. And, in fact, this costs him a move at

later.
Especially in high handicap games, staying simple and connected is a good idea. In this particular case, staying connected also is a nice attack on W @ F4, and preserves the cutting point at D7.
Posted: Mon Jun 20, 2011 2:54 pm
by EdLee
Boyce, your question is good but it's not easy to answer at this level.
In general,

in the game (F6) is the correct shape in reply to

hane (E7).
It's good for around this level to know it. Here, however, it gives W more aji to exploit,
and the pull-back at E5 is more solid. But

in the game is still not a bad move.
Re:
Posted: Mon Jun 20, 2011 4:58 pm
by Redundant
EdLee wrote:But

in the game is still not a bad move.
I should have phrased this better. I meant to say that pulling back was a better shape here. In daily joseki, there's only one hit for

, but 6 for pulling back.