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Two beginners games
Posted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 5:01 am
by johanesek
Hi, please take a look at these games and try to find my biggest weaknesses. I'm currently doing GGPfB vol.2 and reading Opening theory made easy.
This first game i won, but i felt i would lose easily if my opponent would take some time to read. It was played pretty quickly. I had feeling he was trying to play for territory really hard.
http://www.lifein19x19.com/forum/download/file.php?id=1137
This is game i lost due to stupid mistake by not giving enough attention (happens sometimes to me, i hope GO will improve my attention span), but before that i tried to play my best and took some time before placing stones.
http://www.lifein19x19.com/forum/download/file.php?id=1138
Thank You for Your help!
Re: Two beginners games
Posted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 8:28 am
by aurik
Hello,
I feel like you sometimes make extremely defensive moves that are not needed.
For example from game 1,
Move 21 (B@A4): What was the reasoning there? Are you afraid of coming under attack?
Move 27 (B@S4): Same thing. You are spending a move reinforcing needlessly, when you could instead be attacking.
Move 43 or 45: What do you think would happen if you attacked white with p9 here, instead of strengthening your own group?
Move 81: What happens here if you don't defend and play elsewhere?
I see this theme a lot in the first game, but your opponent really helps you by playing lots of small moves.
This also runs through the second game.
Move 21: B@C15? Why not B16 instead?
Move 54: B@C4? Does this group really need reinforcement right now? Why not take this time to attack W with a base-stealing move around C9, (which also extends from your wall above!)
Re: Two beginners games
Posted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 8:50 am
by jts
A few comments on some life and death from the second game:
26: This is the right general idea (reduce his eyespace) but the wrong technique. Play B17 first; there's more eyespace in the corner.
28: No, this is a mistake. Unless you're sure he can escape, it's okay for him to capture 1 or 2 stones on the edge. If he captures two stones, just throw in a third stone to make the eye false. If, after capturing, he tries to get out - say, with H19 - play J18 and let him crawl along the first line for as long as he likes. Play B17 instead.
30&32: You can still get a ko in either diagram by playing B17.
38: This is the right general idea (jump towards the center), but you can't make a knight's jump when there are enemy stones on both sides of it and you're weak in the area. Your opponent can slice right through it. (It would be like making a 1-point jump where there was already an enemy stone peeping it.)
206: You can make a small capture here by threatening to kill. Play a7; If he tries to save a5, you then go back to playing d9 and kill. If he plays d8, capture a5.
Re: Two beginners games
Posted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 5:35 pm
by Joaz Banbeck
(;GM[1]FF[4]CA[UTF-8]AP[CGoban:3]ST[2]RU[Japanese]SZ[19]KM[0.50]TM[2100]OT[5x35 byo-yomi]PW[Teepot]PB[johanesek]WR[16k]BR[17k]DT[2011-09-10]PC[The KGS Go Server at
http://www.gokgs.com/]RE[B+5.50];B[pd]BL[2086.011];W[dd]WL[2091.297];B[pq]BL[2076.89];W[nr]WL[2073.412]C[JB: A slack move by your opponent. It appears to approach the corner from the west, but your stone is already in the western edge of the corner. A move like '2' by white would have been far better.]LB[qo:A][qo:1][qo:2](;B[dp]BL[2062.199]C[JB: It is probably ok to tenuki, but a local move would not be amiss. See variations.];W[nq]WL[2071.357]C[JB: Another slack move by your opponent, He is way too heavy.];B[po]BL[2058.518]C[JB: Good.];W[pr]WL[2063.901];B[qr]BL[2055.445];W[oq]WL[2051.483](;B[pp]BL[2049.399]C[JB: He can play irritating moves like 'a' or 'b' later. ]LB[qs:A][rr:B];W[eq]WL[2041.408];B[dq]BL[2042.504];W[ep]WL[2036.596];B[eo]BL[2040.253]C[JB: Good!];W[dr]WL[2033.072];B[cr]BL[2037.647];W[er]WL[2031.333];B[do]BL[2026.611]C[JB: Yes! Excellent move for 20k.];W[dl]WL[2026.659](;B[ap]BL[2025.628]C[JB: This is the first really bad move that you have made. ( Up to this move, I could believe that you were a 5k ) It lacks any clear purpose. See variations.];W[qs]WL[2015.615];B[rr]BL[2020.841];W[ps]WL[2012.597]C[JB: Another really small move by your opponent.];B[pj]BL[1998.682]C[JB: Good!];W[pm]WL[1998.84](;B[rp]BL[1996.2]C[JB: A solid defensive move, but too defensive, This is the kind of move that you should make if you are surrounded and almost dead. See variations];W[fo]WL[1985.796];B[jd]BL[1989.779];W[ph]WL[1980.221](;B[qm]BL[1986.506]C[JB: One-on-one contact moves are generally defender's moves. As an attacker, you usually will do best staying one space away, and getting closer only when you actually have to fill liberties.
See variations];W[pk]WL[1972.707];B[qk]BL[1984.25];W[ql]WL[1967.562];B[rl]BL[1980.979];W[pl]WL[1963.348];B[rj]BL[1978.53];W[qn]WL[1961.443];B[rm]BL[1971.724];W[qo]WL[1957.257];B[pn]BL[1969.939];W[oj]WL[1945.75](;B[pi]BL[1947.318]C[JB: Too solid, too defensive. See variation.];W[oi]WL[1941.674](;B[qh]BL[1900.419]C[JB: Again, too defensive. See variation];W[nd]WL[1920.883];B[pg]BL[1894.593]C[JB: **** End comments ****];W[og]WL[1913.181];B[oh]BL[1891.023];W[nh]WL[1911.037];B[ph]BL[1887.591];W[nk]WL[1908.167];B[of]BL[1881.179];W[nf]WL[1902.896];B[ng]BL[1878.776];W[mg]WL[1901.008];B[og]BL[1876.256];W[mi]WL[1898.673];B[mf]BL[1804.192];W[qc]WL[1889.575];B[ne]BL[1799.922];W[pc]WL[1878.724];B[od]BL[1795.883];W[oc]WL[1876.48];B[md]BL[1789.015];W[qe]WL[1874.924];B[nc]BL[1783.387];W[qd]WL[1872.126];B[qf]BL[1775.839];W[rf]WL[1869.887];B[rg]BL[1771.292];W[re]WL[1862.217];B[ob]BL[1766.034];W[pb]WL[1860.274];B[na]BL[1761.392];W[rb]WL[1855.099];B[sf]BL[1749.887];W[se]WL[1852.898];B[sg]BL[1747.63];W[on]WL[1845.913];B[qp]BL[1736.231];W[no]WL[1837.847];B[lg]BL[1732.223];W[cn]WL[1821.248];B[mh]BL[1728.687];W[fn]WL[1799.805];B[fd]BL[1712.245];W[hd]WL[1795.807];B[hc]BL[1708.394];W[ec]WL[1788.106];B[gd]BL[1702.151];W[he]WL[1779.899];B[fc]BL[1689.814];W[df]WL[1774.902];B[dj]BL[1680.732];W[ej]WL[1765.116];B[ei]BL[1675.486];W[dk]WL[1758.242];B[di]BL[1673.597];W[ch]WL[1747.924];B[fi]BL[1664.876];W[fj]WL[1741.189];B[gi]BL[1651.153];W[ff]WL[1733.049];B[gj]BL[1640.211];W[gb]WL[1708.119];B[gc]BL[1632.79];W[fb]WL[1705.755];B[fl]BL[1626.994];W[ic]WL[1696.226];B[id]BL[1620.18];W[ib]WL[1690.799];B[hb]BL[1613.111];W[ha]WL[1685.087];B[jc]BL[1609.948];W[jb]WL[1673.099];B[kb]BL[1605.097];W[ge]WL[1668.029];B[ja]BL[1601.438];W[db]WL[1654.757];B[ia]BL[1596.533];W[lh]WL[1631.075];B[ni]BL[1592.575];W[nj]WL[1629.111];B[nh]BL[1589.257];W[lj]WL[1625.852];B[kh]BL[1586.955];W[fm]WL[1603.404];B[ek]BL[1583.827];W[el]WL[1601.106];B[fk]BL[1581.15];W[hm]WL[1591.728];B[em]BL[1572.224];W[cj]WL[1583.318];B[ci]BL[1558.65];W[dm]WL[1579.41];B[ck]BL[1541.918];W[bh]WL[1561.562];B[bj]BL[1524.99];W[en]WL[1547.619];B[cm]BL[1473.047];W[dn]WL[1538.92];B[bo]BL[1465.049];W[co]WL[1530.329];B[cp]BL[1458.344];W[bn]WL[1508.087];B[bq]BL[1411.259];W[bm]WL[1502.465];B[cl]BL[1407.561];W[jp]WL[1496.552];B[hl]BL[1383.682];W[gm]WL[1489.736];B[il]BL[1379.962];W[im]WL[1486.725];B[jl]BL[1376.476];W[jm]WL[1484.685];B[li]BL[1367.835];W[lm]WL[1474.435];B[mj]BL[1365.741];W[mk]WL[1470.488];B[lk]BL[1363.831];W[ll]WL[1464.087];B[kj]BL[1361.256];W[kl]WL[1450.302];B[kk]BL[1357.386];W[nm]WL[1442.296];B[dg]BL[1338.248];W[cf]WL[1430.814];B[dh]BL[1336.01];W[cg]WL[1427.87];B[fg]BL[1333.514];W[eg]WL[1418.695];B[gg]BL[1328.705];W[if]WL[1410.615];B[gf]BL[1326.896];W[fe]WL[1403.672];B[ie]BL[1324.837];W[hf]WL[1400.488];B[jg]BL[1322.052];W[ee]WL[1382.623];B[jf]BL[1307.118];W[ig]WL[1374.231];B[ih]BL[1305.215];W[ed]WL[1367.804];B[ga]BL[1300.792];W[fa]WL[1365.575];B[ha]BL[1296.955];W[jr]WL[1342.011];B[eh]BL[1285.198];W[bi]WL[1327.085];B[ai]BL[1277.899];W[ah]WL[1325.342];B[aj]BL[1276.289];W[bc]WL[1308.152];B[pe]BL[1255.288];W[op]WL[1301.161];B[rs]BL[1247.518];W[oo]WL[1280.85];B[bl]BL[1234.419];W[pa]WL[1271.756];B[oa]BL[1223.322];W[an]WL[1265.666];B[ao]BL[1214.435];W[cs]WL[1263.953];B[bs]BL[1212.244];W[ds]WL[1262.129];B[br]BL[1207.405];W[al]WL[1250.104];B[ak]BL[1205.343];W[am]WL[1245.739];B[gl]BL[1195.361];W[ol]WL[1233.867];B[hg]BL[1191.858];W[bb]WL[1195.908]C[go2eleven [17k]: black e14
];B[]BL[1118.942];W[]WL[1195.907]TW[aa][ba][ca][da][ea][qa][ra][sa][ab][cb][eb][qb][sb][ac][cc][dc][rc][sc][ad][bd][cd][rd][sd][ae][be][ce][de][af][bf][ag][bg][ok][ml][nl][em][km][mm][om][gn][hn][in][jn][kn][ln][mn][nn][go][ho][io][jo][ko][lo][mo][fp][gp][hp][ip][kp][lp][mp][np][fq][gq][hq][iq][jq][kq][lq][mq][fr][gr][hr][ir][kr][lr][mr][or][es][fs][gs][hs][is][js][ks][ls][ms][ns][os]TB[ka][la][ma][ib][jb][lb][mb][nb][ic][kc][lc][mc][kd][ld][nd][je][ke][le][me][oe][kf][lf][nf][pf][kg][mg][qg][fh][gh][hh][jh][lh][rh][sh][hi][ii][ji][ki][mi][qi][ri][si][cj][ej][fj][hj][ij][jj][lj][qj][sj][bk][gk][hk][ik][jk][rk][sk][sl][sm][qn][rn][sn][qo][ro][so][bp][sp][aq][cq][qq][rq][sq][ar][sr][as][ss]C[johanesek [17k]: ty for the game
Teepot [17k]: nice game
Teepot [17k]:

])(;B[oh]))(;B[oi];W[pi](;B[qj])))(;B[nj]C[JB: Note that both of his stones are in danger of being surrounded.]))(;B[no]C[JB: Run out into the center. It makes you much harder to kill, and it starts to surround him. ( It has the third purpose of preparing an invasion of his potential territory on the lower side. )])(;B[on]C[JB: The same idea as #2, but focussed a bit more on attacking.]))(;B[bq]C[JB: If you want to play really defensively, this is the better move. It clearly separates your space into two chunks so that you can look forward to making two eyes.])(;B[hq]C[JB: This is an aggressive move, leading to a fighting game. It probably works because your marked stones are stronger than his marked stones. Your stones have eye space. His do not. Your stones can run outward ( from E5 ) His stones cannot run toward the center.]TR[eo][do][dp][dq][cr]CR[ep][eq][er][dr])(;B[di]C[JB: A different attack, capitalizing on the fact that you have the power of D5/E5.]))(;B[qq]C[JB: This is a tiny bit better than the move you played. Yours was fine for a 20k. I would normally be suggesting this for the 5k who is trying to make 1D. He can only play 'a' here.]LB[qs:A]))(;B[qo]C[JB: A good solid shamari secures your corner.])(;B[op]C[JB: A more agressive move, taking advantage of the fact that O2 is misplaced. It threatens to kill with 'a', or make the beginnings of a big territorial framework with 'b'.]LB[mq:A][pj:B]))
As other reviewers have noted, your play is excessively defensive. When a defensive move is required, often you play very well. But there are many times when you defend one stone ( such as all of the possible kos in the above game ) for a total profit of one point or less, when there are bigger moves available.
When you a group does need to be defended, often it is better to run out than to stay home and make eyes.
Re: Two beginners games
Posted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 11:45 pm
by johanesek
Thank You for Your help. Move 21 was a missclick, i'm used to spamming clicks from SC:BW , but APM doesn't matter in this game apparently

Re: Two beginners games
Posted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 12:44 am
by Solomon
johanesek wrote:i'm used to spamming clicks from SC:BW , but APM doesn't matter in this game apparently

Sure, but you have to macro territory harder and micro your groups.