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My attempt at a 3-dan problem (black to play)

Posted: Fri Jul 05, 2013 7:07 pm
by tekesta
I know I'm not 三段, but I just had to try this one out :mrgreen:

Image

My answer: 1@AB, 2@AC, 3@DC, 4@CC, 5@DB, 6@DA, 7@EC

I chose Black 1 @ AB since Black threatens to connect out. White plays @ AC to prevent it. Black 3 puts the 4 Whites into atari. White 4 connects. Black 5 extends to the 2nd line. White 6 @ EC is not an option due to shortage of liberties, so White plays @ DA to atari the 2 Blacks. Black 7 at EC puts 4 Whites into atari.

Another answer: 1@AB, 2@AC, 3@DB, 4@DC, 5@EC, 6@DA, 7@BB, 8@CC, 9@BA

White 4 @ EC will result in two White groups in atari once Black plays at DC, so White plays at DC. Double atari after Black 5. White captures @ DA. Atari on 2 White stones with Black 7. White 8 is at CC to connect. After Black 9 White group cannot atari 3 Black stones in the corner due to shortage of liberties.

Re: My attempt at a 3-dan problem (black to play)

Posted: Fri Jul 05, 2013 11:07 pm
by Sverre
tekesta wrote: My answer: 1@AB, 2@AC, 3@DC, 4@CC, 5@DB, 6@DA, 7@EC

I chose Black 1 @ AB since Black threatens to connect out. White plays @ AC to prevent it. Black 3 puts the 4 Whites into atari. White 4 connects. Black 5 extends to the 2nd line. White 6 @ EC is not an option due to shortage of liberties, so White plays @ DA to atari the 2 Blacks. Black 7 at EC puts 4 Whites into atari.

Another answer: 1@AB, 2@AC, 3@DB, 4@DC, 5@EC, 6@DA, 7@BB, 8@CC, 9@BA

White 4 @ EC will result in two White groups in atari once Black plays at DC, so White plays at DC. Double atari after Black 5. White captures @ DA. Atari on 2 White stones with Black 7. White 8 is at CC to connect. After Black 9 White group cannot atari 3 Black stones in the corner due to shortage of liberties.
I tried to translate your variations to diagrams, is this correct?
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Problem
$$|........
$$|........
$$|XXX.....
$$|XOOXX...
$$|XXOOX...
$$|.O...X..
$$|..O.OX.X
$$|....OOX.
$$---------[/go]
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Your first variation
$$|........
$$|........
$$|XXX.....
$$|XOOXX...
$$|XXOOX...
$$|2O437X..
$$|1.O5OX.X
$$|...6OOX.
$$---------[/go]
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Your second variation
$$|........
$$|........
$$|XXX.....
$$|XOOXX...
$$|XXOOX...
$$|2O845X..
$$|17O3OX.X
$$|.9.6OOX.
$$---------[/go]
If so, I think the first variation is wrong because White can sacrifice his 4 stones. How do you play after :w4:? And your second variation is seki.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Your first variation
$$|........
$$|........
$$|XXX.....
$$|XOOXX...
$$|XXOOX...
$$|2O.3.X..
$$|1.O4OX.X
$$|....OOX.
$$---------[/go]

Re: My attempt at a 3-dan problem (black to play)

Posted: Sat Jul 06, 2013 9:19 am
by Shaddy
My attempt:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Problem
$$|........
$$|........
$$|XXX.....
$$|XOOXX...
$$|XXOOX...
$$|.O75.X..
$$|21O6OX.X
$$|834.OOX.
$$---------[/go]
9-1

Re: My attempt at a 3-dan problem (black to play)

Posted: Sat Jul 06, 2013 9:27 am
by illluck
Shaddy wrote:My attempt:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Problem
$$|........
$$|........
$$|XXX.....
$$|XOOXX...
$$|XXOOX...
$$|.O75.X..
$$|21O6OX.X
$$|834.OOX.
$$---------[/go]
9-1
@Shaddy:
Ko?
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Problem
$$|........
$$|........
$$|XXX.....
$$|XOOXX...
$$|XXOOX...
$$|.O.4.X..
$$|21O.OX.X
$$|.3..OOX.
$$---------[/go]

Re: My attempt at a 3-dan problem (black to play)

Posted: Sat Jul 06, 2013 12:01 pm
by illluck
Shaddy's variation is quite valuable as that idea didn't even occur to me. Using his variation as the basis:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Problem
$$|........
$$|........
$$|XXX.....
$$|XOOXX...
$$|XXOOX...
$$|4O21.X..
$$|3.O5OX.X
$$|....OOX.
$$---------[/go]
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Problem
$$|........
$$|........
$$|XXX.....
$$|XOOXX...
$$|XXOOX...
$$|.O.1.X..
$$|43O2OX.X
$$|.56.OOX.
$$---------[/go]
And so on with Shaddy's variation.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Problem
$$|........
$$|........
$$|XXX.....
$$|XOOXX...
$$|XXOOX...
$$|bO61aX..
$$|43O2OX.X
$$|.57.OOX.
$$---------[/go]
If a then b and it's a golden chicken standing on one leg.

Re: My attempt at a 3-dan problem (black to play)

Posted: Sat Jul 06, 2013 4:39 pm
by tekesta
@Sverre: Yes, that is the problem depicted in the photo. The diagrams correctly depict the sequences I mentioned. Thank you for producing the diagrams.
--------------------------------
I had a feeling that the first answer would not work since White can live by sacrificing the top 4 stones. The second answer would be closer to the correct solution, although seki is probably not the answer that the author of the problem wants. Shaddy's answer with throw-in as final move never occurred to me. Now I see why it's rated 3-dan.

In any case it's fun to play around with these tsumego :D Thanks to all who posted here for your answers.

Re: My attempt at a 3-dan problem (black to play)

Posted: Sat Jul 06, 2013 6:35 pm
by Shaddy
Damn, I got the order wrong. I'm really rusty, it seems..