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Self review of 5 stone game - Comments greatly appreciated!
Posted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 3:47 pm
by illluck
I played the below game (taking 5 stones) against JeansebL in the OGS tournament yesterday. Since I was a bit underranked (and beat him in an even game a few months back) I thought it would be a fairly easy game. I ended up losing the game, and have made some comments to facilitate discussion/provide newer players with examples of what not to do. Comments, irrespective of rank, are welcome and would be greatly appreciated.
(;GM[1]FF[4]CA[UTF-8]AP[CGoban:3]ST[2]
RU[Japanese]SZ[19]HA[5]KM[0.50]
PW[JeansebL]PB[illluck]WR[5d]BR[1k]DT[2013-10-27]CP[online-go.com]PC[OGS:
http://online-go.com/game/418904]AB[dd][pd][jj][dp][pp]RE[W+2.50]
;W[qf]
;B[nc]
;W[nq]
;B[qn]
;W[fq]
;B[jp]
;W[dm]
;B[eo]C[ I decided to play the kosumi out because attaching at F4 doesn't weaken D7 too much and I'm not too worried about white 3-3 because D7 would end up a bit misplaced after I block at D3.]
;W[hp]
;B[fn]C[Not too sure about this. I didn't want to give white any chance to seal me inside, but perhaps something like E7 first for sente to play N4 may be better.]
;W[hn]
(;B[fl]C[This probably better at N4. I was a bit worried about F7 or G7, but I think I should be fine (see variations).]
;W[dj]
(;B[oq]C[Perhaps too optimistic. N4 looks better (see variations).]
;W[np]
;B[lp]
;W[on]
;B[pm]C[This is looking at pincering R14 later, but probably better to jump out with something like M6 instead.]
;W[km]
;B[nr]C[A bit inconsistent - M4 is at risk of being a wasted move now.]
;W[mr]
;B[or]
;W[lq]
;B[qi]
;W[gj]
;B[cm]
;W[cl]
;B[cn]
;W[cf]
;B[df]
;W[de]C[Yeah, I forgot how this joseki went XD]
;B[ee]
;W[ce]
;B[ef]C[Should be E16 instead. I didn't like giving up E14 if white cuts at E14, but difference in corner too big.]
;W[ed]
;B[fd]
;W[ec]
;B[fc]
;W[db]
;B[eb]
;W[dc]
;B[dh]C[Fishing while house is on fire - F15 cut too annoying.]
;W[ii]
;B[jd]
;W[fe]
;B[gg]
;W[ge]
;B[he]
;W[gd]
;B[gc]
;W[hd]
;B[hc]
;W[id]
;B[ic]
;W[if]
;B[je]
;W[hf]
;B[ej]
;W[ek]
;B[fk]
;W[fj]
;B[ei]
;W[bi]
;B[cj]
;W[ck]
;B[ci]
;W[bj]
;B[bh]
;W[cg]
;B[ai]C[Terrible misread - I thought D11 and then D9 captures E9. I'm not sure I can win the race with the connect, but it would be a lot better in terms of ko threats, aji, and endgame.]
;W[ch]
;B[di]
;W[bk]
;B[hk]
;W[hh]
;B[im]
;W[in]
;B[qe]
;W[kg]
;B[pf]
;W[nl]
;B[eq]
;W[fr]
;B[er]
;W[po]
;B[qo]
;W[op]
;B[qq]
;W[kc]
;B[jc]
;W[mc]
;B[ld]
;W[md]
;B[me]
;W[nd]
;B[oc]
;W[of]
;B[ne]
;W[pg]
;B[pe]
;W[pi]
;B[qj]
;W[oe]
;B[od]
;W[ng]
;B[lf]
;W[lg]
;B[jm]
;W[jn]
;B[kl]
;W[ll]
;B[lm]
;W[kn]
;B[lk]
;W[ml]
;B[hj]
;W[gi]
;B[kk]
;W[qh]
;B[pj]
;W[rf]
;B[re]
;W[fb]
;B[gb]
;W[kf]
;B[kd]
;W[se]
;B[sd]
;W[sf]
;B[fs]
;W[rd]
;B[rc]
;W[sc]
;B[hs]
;W[hr]
;B[ir]
;W[iq]
;B[jr]
;W[jq]
;B[kr]
;W[kq]
;B[rb]
;W[bm]
;B[bn]
;W[an]
;B[ao]
;W[am]
;B[bp]
;W[gr]
;B[gs]
;W[el]
;B[em]C[F7 better.]
;W[gm]
;B[fm]
;W[ri]
;B[rj]
;W[sh]
;B[oi]
;W[ph]
;B[fa]
;W[sj]
;B[rk]
;W[sk]
;B[sl]
;W[si]
;B[rl]
;W[ni]
;B[oj]
;W[mf]
;B[le]
;W[ki]
;B[hm]
;W[sb]
;B[qd]
;W[sd]
;B[mh]
;W[nh]
;B[nf]
;W[mg]
;B[og]
;W[oh]
;B[da]
;W[cb]
;B[ca]
;W[ba]
;B[ea]
;W[bb]
;B[ie]
;W[gf]
;B[om]
;W[nm]
;B[ra]
;W[dn]
;B[do]
;W[gn]
;B[ls]
;W[gl]
;B[gk]
;W[hl]
;B[ik]
;W[il]
;B[jl]
;W[ms]
;B[lr]
;W[lj]
;B[mj]
;W[mi]
;B[ji]
;W[jh]
;B[kj]
;W[li]
;B[hi]
;W[gh]
;B[mk]
;W[ol]
;B[pl]C[F4 better.]
;W[fp]
;B[fo]
;W[go]
;B[dl]
;W[dk]
;B[en]
;W[al]
;B[of]
;W[ok]
;B[pn]
;W[oo]
;B[dl]
;W[dm]
;B[ns]
;W[mq]
;B[jf]
;W[jg]
;B[ij]
;W[ih]
;B[pk]
;W[ep]
;B[nk]
;W[nn]
;B[dn]
;W[dq]
;B[dr]
;W[ke]
;B[dl]
;W[es]
;B[ds]
;W[dm]
;B[nj]
;W[dl]
;B[]
;W[])
(;B[mp]
;W[np]
;B[mo]
(;W[lr]
;B[no])
(;W[no]
;B[mq])))
(;B[mp]
(;W[fm]
;B[gm]
(;W[en]
;B[fl]
;W[em]
;B[gn]
;W[fo]
;B[fp]
;W[go]
;B[gp]
;W[ho]
;B[gq])
(;W[gn]
;B[em]
;W[fl]
;B[el]))
(;W[gm]
;B[el]
;W[em]
;B[fm]
;W[fl]
;B[dl]
;W[cl]
;B[fk]
;W[gl]
;B[cm]
;W[cn]
;B[bm]
;W[dn]
;B[bn]
;W[co]
;B[bo]
;W[cp]
;B[cq])))
Re: Self review of 5 stone game - Comments greatly appreciat
Posted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 4:25 pm
by Pippen
I think move 10 is a mistake, because too slow. You know you can live in the corner and that should be enough at this point. Grab some bigger point, e.g. r12.
Re: Self review of 5 stone game - Comments greatly appreciat
Posted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 5:09 pm
by illluck
Just realized that I didn't actually look at the most important fight of the game XD
Below sgf has some random variations starting at move 64. Obviously too complicated for me to read out during the game, but black seems to come out OK (the best result for both I found is black saving half the group in sente).
(;GM[1]FF[4]CA[UTF-8]AP[CGoban:3]ST[2]
RU[Japanese]SZ[19]HA[5]KM[0.50]
PW[JeansebL]PB[illluck]WR[5d]BR[1k]DT[2013-10-27]CP[online-go.com]PC[OGS:
http://online-go.com/game/418904]AB[dd][pd][jj][dp][pp]RE[W+2.50]
;W[qf]
;B[nc]
;W[nq]
;B[qn]
;W[fq]
;B[jp]
;W[dm]
;B[eo]C[ I decided to play the kosumi out because attaching at F4 doesn't weaken D7 too much and I'm not too worried about white 3-3 because D7 would end up a bit misplaced after I block at D3.]
;W[hp]
;B[fn]C[Not too sure about this. I didn't want to give white any chance to seal me inside, but perhaps something like E7 first for sente to play N4 may be better.]
;W[hn]
(;B[fl]C[This probably better at N4. I was a bit worried about F7 or G7, but I think I should be fine (see variations).]
;W[dj]
(;B[oq]C[Perhaps too optimistic. N4 looks better (see variations).]
;W[np]
;B[lp]
;W[on]
;B[pm]C[This is looking at pincering R14 later, but probably better to jump out with something like M6 instead.]
;W[km]
;B[nr]C[A bit inconsistent - M4 is at risk of being a wasted move now.]
;W[mr]
;B[or]
;W[lq]
;B[qi]
;W[gj]
;B[cm]
;W[cl]
;B[cn]
;W[cf]
;B[df]
;W[de]C[Yeah, I forgot how this joseki went XD]
;B[ee]
;W[ce]
;B[ef]C[Should be E16 instead. I didn't like giving up E14 if white cuts at E14, but difference in corner too big.]
;W[ed]
;B[fd]
;W[ec]
;B[fc]
;W[db]
;B[eb]
;W[dc]
;B[dh]C[Fishing while house is on fire - F15 cut too annoying.]
;W[ii]
;B[jd]
;W[fe]
;B[gg]
;W[ge]
;B[he]
;W[gd]
;B[gc]
;W[hd]
;B[hc]
;W[id]
;B[ic]
;W[if]
;B[je]
;W[hf]
;B[ej]
;W[ek]
;B[fk]
;W[fj]
;B[ei]
;W[bi]
(;B[cj]C[See variation.]
;W[ck]
;B[ci]
;W[bj]
;B[bh]
;W[cg]
;B[ai]C[Terrible misread - I thought D11 and then D9 captures E9. I'm not sure I can win the race with the connect, but it would be a lot better in terms of ko threats, aji, and endgame.]
;W[ch]
;B[di]
;W[bk]
;B[hk]
;W[hh]
;B[im]
;W[in]
;B[qe]
;W[kg]
;B[pf]
;W[nl]
;B[eq]
;W[fr]
;B[er]
;W[po]
;B[qo]
;W[op]
;B[qq]
;W[kc]
;B[jc]
;W[mc]
;B[ld]
;W[md]
;B[me]
;W[nd]
;B[oc]
;W[of]
;B[ne]
;W[pg]
;B[pe]
;W[pi]
;B[qj]
;W[oe]
;B[od]
;W[ng]
;B[lf]
;W[lg]
;B[jm]
;W[jn]
;B[kl]
;W[ll]
;B[lm]
;W[kn]
;B[lk]
;W[ml]
;B[hj]
;W[gi]
;B[kk]
;W[qh]
;B[pj]
;W[rf]
;B[re]
;W[fb]
;B[gb]
;W[kf]
;B[kd]
;W[se]
;B[sd]
;W[sf]
;B[fs]
;W[rd]
;B[rc]
;W[sc]
;B[hs]
;W[hr]
;B[ir]
;W[iq]
;B[jr]
;W[jq]
;B[kr]
;W[kq]
;B[rb]
;W[bm]
;B[bn]
;W[an]
;B[ao]
;W[am]
;B[bp]
;W[gr]
;B[gs]
;W[el]
;B[em]C[F7 better.]
;W[gm]
;B[fm]
;W[ri]
;B[rj]
;W[sh]
;B[oi]
;W[ph]
;B[fa]
;W[sj]
;B[rk]
;W[sk]
;B[sl]
;W[si]
;B[rl]
;W[ni]
;B[oj]
;W[mf]
;B[le]
;W[ki]
;B[hm]
;W[sb]
;B[qd]
;W[sd]
;B[mh]
;W[nh]
;B[nf]
;W[mg]
;B[og]
;W[oh]
;B[da]
;W[cb]
;B[ca]
;W[ba]
;B[ea]
;W[bb]
;B[ie]
;W[gf]
;B[om]
;W[nm]
;B[ra]
;W[dn]
;B[do]
;W[gn]
;B[ls]
;W[gl]
;B[gk]
;W[hl]
;B[ik]
;W[il]
;B[jl]
;W[ms]
;B[lr]
;W[lj]
;B[mj]
;W[mi]
;B[ji]
;W[jh]
;B[kj]
;W[li]
;B[hi]
;W[gh]
;B[mk]
;W[ol]
;B[pl]C[F4 better.]
;W[fp]
;B[fo]
;W[go]
;B[dl]
;W[dk]
;B[en]
;W[al]
;B[of]
;W[ok]
;B[pn]
;W[oo]
;B[dl]
;W[dm]
;B[ns]
;W[mq]
;B[jf]
;W[jg]
;B[ij]
;W[ih]
;B[pk]
;W[ep]
;B[nk]
;W[nn]
;B[dn]
;W[dq]
;B[dr]
;W[ke]
;B[dl]
;W[es]
;B[ds]
;W[dm]
;B[nj]
;W[dl]
;B[]
;W[])
(;B[dk]
;W[el]
;B[ck]
(;W[fm]
;B[em]
(;W[en]
;B[dl]
;W[em]
;B[gm])
(;W[dl]
;B[bl]
;W[en]
;B[dn]))
(;W[dl]
;B[bk]
;W[bl]
;B[ci]
(;W[bj]
;B[cj]
;W[ak]
;B[bh]
(;W[fm]
;B[gm]
;W[em]
;B[gl]
;W[gn]
;B[hl]
(;W[il]
;B[hk]C[White can't capture H9.])
(;W[ik]
;B[il]
;W[jl]
;B[im]
(;W[jm]
;B[in]
(;W[jo]
;B[io]
;W[ip]
;B[jn]
;W[ko]
;B[kn])
(;W[io]
;B[jn]
;W[jo]
;B[kn]))
(;W[in]
;B[hk]
(;W[hj]
;B[jk]
;W[ij]
;B[jm]
;W[kl]
;B[jn])
(;W[ij]
;B[hj]
;W[hi]
;B[gi]
;W[fi]
;B[gh]
;W[eh]
;B[di]
;W[fh]
;B[eg]))))
(;W[en]
;B[fm]))
(;W[ch]
;B[cj])
(;W[cj]
;B[bj]
;W[aj]
;B[di]))
(;W[cj]
;B[bk]
;W[bl]
;B[dl]
;W[em]
;B[bm]
;W[fm]
;B[bh]
;W[aj]
;B[ak]
(;W[ch]
;B[cg]
;W[bg]
;B[ci]
;W[bj]
;B[al]
;W[ah]
;B[ch]
;W[bf]
;B[di])
(;W[bg]
;B[ci]
(;W[ah]
(;B[ch]
;W[bj]
;B[al]
;W[ai]
;B[di]
;W[ag]
;B[cg]
;W[bf]
;B[gf]
;W[ie]
;B[eg]
;W[fh]
;B[fi]
;W[gh]
;B[gi]
(;W[hi]
;B[hh]
(;W[gl]
;B[hg])
(;W[hg]
;B[hj]
;W[gk]
;B[gl]
;W[hk]
;B[hl]
;W[ik]
;B[gm]
;W[ih]
;B[en]
;W[eh]
;B[dn]))
(;W[hh]
;B[hj]
;W[gk]
;B[gl]
;W[hk]
;B[hl]
;W[ik]
;B[gm]
;W[hi]
;B[en]
;W[ff]
;B[dn]))
(;B[di]))
(;W[bj]
;B[al]
;W[ah]
;B[ch]
;W[ag]
;B[di]
;W[ai]
;B[cg]
;W[bf]
;B[gf]
;W[ie]
;B[eg]
;W[fh]
;B[fi]
;W[gh]
;B[gi]
;W[hi]
;B[hh]
;W[hg]
;B[hj]
;W[gk]
;B[gl]
;W[hk]
;B[hl]
;W[ik]
;B[gm])))
(;W[bk]
;B[cj]
;W[ci]
;B[di]
(;W[bl]
;B[dj]
;W[dl]
;B[bj]
;W[aj]
;B[bh]
;W[bg]
;B[ch]
;W[ah]
;B[ai]
;W[bi]
;B[cg]
;W[bf]
;B[eg]
;W[fh]
;B[fi]
;W[gh]
;B[gi]
;W[hi]
;B[hh]
;W[hg]
;B[hj]
;W[gk]
;B[gl]
;W[hk]
;B[ij]
;W[fg]
;B[ff]
(;W[gf]
;B[ih]
;W[ji]
;B[eh]
;W[gg]
;B[jh]
;W[ki]
(;B[jf])
(;B[il]))
(;W[ih]
;B[gf]
;W[ie]
;B[il]))
(;W[bj]
;B[dj]
;W[dl]
;B[bm]
;W[bl]
;B[cg]
;W[bg]
;B[ch]
;W[bh]
;B[gf]
;W[ie]
;B[eg]
;W[fh]
;B[hg]
(;W[gh]
;B[jh]
(;W[jf]
;B[kf]
;W[kg]
;B[jg]
;W[ke]
;B[lf]
;W[eh]
;B[dg]
;W[ff]
;B[fg])
(;W[eh]
;B[ig]
;W[jf]
;B[kf]
;W[jg]
;B[kg]
;W[fi]
;B[dg]))
(;W[ig]
;B[fi]
;W[gh]
;B[gi]
;W[hh])
(;W[eh]
;B[jh]
;W[ig]
;B[ih]
(;W[fi]
;B[hi]
;W[dg]
;B[eq])
(;W[hh]
;B[gh]
;W[fi]
;B[hi]
;W[dg]
;B[eq]))))))
(;B[mp]
;W[np]
;B[mo]
(;W[lr]
;B[no])
(;W[no]
;B[mq])))
(;B[mp]
(;W[fm]
;B[gm]
(;W[en]
;B[fl]
;W[em]
;B[gn]
;W[fo]
;B[fp]
;W[go]
;B[gp]
;W[ho]
;B[gq])
(;W[gn]
;B[em]
;W[fl]
;B[el]))
(;W[gm]
;B[el]
;W[em]
;B[fm]
;W[fl]
;B[dl]
;W[cl]
;B[fk]
;W[gl]
;B[cm]
;W[cn]
;B[bm]
;W[dn]
;B[bn]
;W[co]
;B[bo]
;W[cp]
;B[cq])))
Re: Self review of 5 stone game - Comments greatly appreciat
Posted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 9:21 pm
by Eizero
(;GM[1]FF[4]CA[UTF-8]AP[CGoban:3]ST[2]
RU[Japanese]SZ[19]HA[5]KM[0.50]
PW[JeansebL]PB[illluck]WR[5d]BR[1k]DT[2013-10-27]CP[online-go.com]PC[OGS: <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://online-go.com/game/418904">http://online-go.com/game/418904</a><!-- m -->]AB[dd][pd][jj][dp][pp]RE[W+2.50]
;W[qf]
;B[nc]
;W[nq]
;B[qn]
;W[fq]
;B[jp]
;W[dm]
;B[eo]
;W[hp]
;B[fn]
;W[hn]
(;B[fl]
;W[dj]C[Bad exchange? Before you could pincer and attack white, but now white get an easy two space extension. see variation ]
(;B[oq]
;W[np]
;B[lp]
;W[on]
(;B[pm]C[too passive? this seems only to prevent white r7]
;W[km]C[white is too thin here you shold definatel ytry to break out. ]
(;B[nr]C[I think this is bad this is like saying "I'm giving up the two stones inside". ]
;W[mr]
;B[or]
;W[lq]C[it just seems harder for black to make sabaki here. ]
(;B[qi]C[This is quite passive too.]
;W[gj]C[I think this is basically a trick move. see variation.]
(;B[cm]C[very passive]
;W[cl]
;B[cn]C[you removed some of his weakness while gaining nothing much]
;W[cf]C[white got the key point.]
(;B[df]C[i wouldn't go here in the first place. ]
;W[de]C[Yeah, I forgot how this joseki went XD]
;B[ee]
;W[ce]
(;B[ef]C[Should be E16 instead. I didn't like giving up E14 if white cuts at E14, but difference in corner too big.]
;W[ed]
;B[fd]
;W[ec]
;B[fc]
;W[db]
;B[eb]
;W[dc]C[huge losss.]
(;B[dh]C[end of comments]
;W[ii]
;B[jd]
;W[fe]
;B[gg]
;W[ge]
;B[he]
;W[gd]
;B[gc]
;W[hd]
;B[hc]
;W[id]
;B[ic]
;W[if]
;B[je]
;W[hf]
;B[ej]
;W[ek]
;B[fk]
;W[fj]
;B[ei]
;W[bi]
;B[cj]
;W[ck]
;B[ci]
;W[bj]
;B[bh]
;W[cg]
;B[ai]C[Terrible misread - I thought D11 and then D9 captures E9. I'm not sure I can win the race with the connect, but it would be a lot better in terms of ko threats, aji, and endgame.]
;W[ch]
;B[di]
;W[bk]
;B[hk]
;W[hh]
;B[im]
;W[in]
;B[qe]
;W[kg]
;B[pf]
;W[nl]
;B[eq]
;W[fr]
;B[er]
;W[po]
;B[qo]
;W[op]
;B[qq]
;W[kc]
;B[jc]
;W[mc]
;B[ld]
;W[md]
;B[me]
;W[nd]
;B[oc]
;W[of]
;B[ne]
;W[pg]
;B[pe]
;W[pi]
;B[qj]
;W[oe]
;B[od]
;W[ng]
;B[lf]
;W[lg]
;B[jm]
;W[jn]
;B[kl]
;W[ll]
;B[lm]
;W[kn]
;B[lk]
;W[ml]
;B[hj]
;W[gi]
;B[kk]
;W[qh]
;B[pj]
;W[rf]
;B[re]
;W[fb]
;B[gb]
;W[kf]
;B[kd]
;W[se]
;B[sd]
;W[sf]
;B[fs]
;W[rd]
;B[rc]
;W[sc]
;B[hs]
;W[hr]
;B[ir]
;W[iq]
;B[jr]
;W[jq]
;B[kr]
;W[kq]
;B[rb]
;W[bm]
;B[bn]
;W[an]
;B[ao]
;W[am]
;B[bp]
;W[gr]
;B[gs]
;W[el]
;B[em]C[F7 better.]
;W[gm]
;B[fm]
;W[ri]
;B[rj]
;W[sh]
;B[oi]
;W[ph]
;B[fa]
;W[sj]
;B[rk]
;W[sk]
;B[sl]
;W[si]
;B[rl]
;W[ni]
;B[oj]
;W[mf]
;B[le]
;W[ki]
;B[hm]
;W[sb]
;B[qd]
;W[sd]
;B[mh]
;W[nh]
;B[nf]
;W[mg]
;B[og]
;W[oh]
;B[da]
;W[cb]
;B[ca]
;W[ba]
;B[ea]
;W[bb]
;B[ie]
;W[gf]
;B[om]
;W[nm]
;B[ra]
;W[dn]
;B[do]
;W[gn]
;B[ls]
;W[gl]
;B[gk]
;W[hl]
;B[ik]
;W[il]
;B[jl]
;W[ms]
;B[lr]
;W[lj]
;B[mj]
;W[mi]
;B[ji]
;W[jh]
;B[kj]
;W[li]
;B[hi]
;W[gh]
;B[mk]
;W[ol]
;B[pl]C[F4 better.]
;W[fp]
;B[fo]
;W[go]
;B[dl]
;W[dk]
;B[en]
;W[al]
;B[of]
;W[ok]
;B[pn]
;W[oo]
;B[dl]
;W[dm]
;B[ns]
;W[mq]
;B[jf]
;W[jg]
;B[ij]
;W[ih]
;B[pk]
;W[ep]
;B[nk]
;W[nn]
;B[dn]
;W[dq]
;B[dr]
;W[ke]
;B[dl]
;W[es]
;B[ds]
;W[dm]
;B[nj]
;W[dl]
;B[]
;W[])
(;B[qe]C[just take the initative ]))
(;B[ed]
;W[ef]
;B[ff]
;W[eg]
;B[cd]C[that's better maybe?]))
(;B[qe]C[take some intitative i think.])
(;B[fc]C[or go here to exploit the thinness later. ]))
(;B[ch]C[stilla key point i think. ]))
(;B[ch]C[key point for attack. see variation underneath. I think c12 and c14 area vital point for both sides. ])
(;B[]
;W[cf]C[White would like to go here too. ]))
(;B[io]
;W[ho]
;B[jm]
;W[jn]
;B[in]
;W[im]
;B[jl]
(;W[jo]
;B[ip]
;W[ln]
;B[hm]
;W[il]
;B[ik]
;W[hl]
;B[gm]C[white looks screwed h3 and h9 miai ])
(;W[gm]
;B[kn]
;W[fm])))
(;B[jn]C[f3 not alive yet.]))
(;B[mp]
;W[np]
;B[mo]
(;W[lr]
;B[no])
(;W[no]
;B[mq])))
(;B[mp]
(;W[fm]
;B[gm]
(;W[en]
;B[fl]
;W[em]
;B[gn]
;W[fo]
;B[fp]
;W[go]
;B[gp]
;W[ho]
;B[gq])
(;W[gn]
;B[em]
;W[fl]
;B[el]))
(;W[gm]
;B[el]
;W[em]
;B[fm]
;W[fl]
;B[dl]
;W[cl]
;B[fk]
;W[gl]
;B[cm]
;W[cn]
;B[bm]
;W[dn]
;B[bn]
;W[co]
;B[bo]
;W[cp]
;B[cq]))
(;B[dk]C[idk maybe you can pincer like this later on]
;W[el]
;B[gl]
;W[ek]
;B[dj]C[I don't think this could be good for white]))
Re: Self review of 5 stone game - Comments greatly appreciat
Posted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 9:34 pm
by Eizero
(;GM[1]FF[4]CA[UTF-8]AP[CGoban:3]ST[2]
RU[Japanese]SZ[19]HA[5]KM[0.50]
PW[JeansebL]PB[illluck]WR[5d]BR[1k]DT[2013-10-27]CP[online-go.com]PC[OGS: <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://online-go.com/game/418904">http://online-go.com/game/418904</a><!-- m -->]AB[dd][pd][jj][dp][pp]C[i have some additonal comments about some of the fighting later in the game, too lazy to go throuhg all of it. start at move 73]RE[W+2.50]
;W[qf]
;B[nc]
;W[nq]
;B[qn]
;W[fq]
;B[jp]
;W[dm]
;B[eo]
;W[hp]
;B[fn]
;W[hn]
(;B[fl]
;W[dj]C[Bad exchange? Before you could pincer and attack white, but now white get an easy two space extension. see variation ]
(;B[oq]
;W[np]
;B[lp]
;W[on]
(;B[pm]C[too passive? this seems only to prevent white r7]
;W[km]C[white is too thin here you shold definatel ytry to break out. ]
(;B[nr]C[I think this is bad this is like saying "I'm giving up the two stones inside". ]
;W[mr]
;B[or]
;W[lq]C[it just seems harder for black to make sabaki here. ]
(;B[qi]C[This is quite passive too.]
;W[gj]C[I think this is basically a trick move. see variation.]
(;B[cm]C[very passive]
;W[cl]
;B[cn]C[you removed some of his weakness while gaining nothing much]
;W[cf]C[white got the key point.]
(;B[df]C[i wouldn't go here in the first place. ]
;W[de]C[Yeah, I forgot how this joseki went XD]
;B[ee]
;W[ce]
(;B[ef]C[Should be E16 instead. I didn't like giving up E14 if white cuts at E14, but difference in corner too big.]
;W[ed]
;B[fd]
;W[ec]
;B[fc]
;W[db]
;B[eb]
;W[dc]C[huge losss.]
(;B[dh]
;W[ii]
;B[jd]
;W[fe]
;B[gg]
;W[ge]
;B[he]
;W[gd]
;B[gc]
;W[hd]
;B[hc]
;W[id]
;B[ic]
;W[if]
;B[je]
;W[hf]
;B[ej]
;W[ek]
;B[fk]
;W[fj]
;B[ei]
;W[bi]
;B[cj]
;W[ck]
;B[ci]
;W[bj]
;B[bh]
;W[cg]
;B[ai]C[Terrible misread - I thought D11 and then D9 captures E9. I'm not sure I can win the race with the connect, but it would be a lot better in terms of ko threats, aji, and endgame.]
;W[ch]
;B[di]
;W[bk]C[id like to make comments about this center fight but too lazy to go through it xD]
;B[hk]
;W[hh]
(;B[im]C[aji keshi?]
;W[in]
;B[qe]
;W[kg]C[end of comments again]
;B[pf]
;W[nl]
;B[eq]
;W[fr]
;B[er]
;W[po]
;B[qo]
;W[op]
;B[qq]
;W[kc]
;B[jc]
;W[mc]
;B[ld]
;W[md]
;B[me]
;W[nd]
;B[oc]
;W[of]
;B[ne]
;W[pg]
;B[pe]
;W[pi]
;B[qj]
;W[oe]
;B[od]
;W[ng]
;B[lf]
;W[lg]
;B[jm]
;W[jn]
;B[kl]
;W[ll]
;B[lm]
;W[kn]
;B[lk]
;W[ml]
;B[hj]
;W[gi]
;B[kk]
;W[qh]
;B[pj]
;W[rf]
;B[re]
;W[fb]
;B[gb]
;W[kf]
;B[kd]
;W[se]
;B[sd]
;W[sf]
;B[fs]
;W[rd]
;B[rc]
;W[sc]
;B[hs]
;W[hr]
;B[ir]
;W[iq]
;B[jr]
;W[jq]
;B[kr]
;W[kq]
;B[rb]
;W[bm]
;B[bn]
;W[an]
;B[ao]
;W[am]
;B[bp]
;W[gr]
;B[gs]
;W[el]
;B[em]C[F7 better.]
;W[gm]
;B[fm]
;W[ri]
;B[rj]
;W[sh]
;B[oi]
;W[ph]
;B[fa]
;W[sj]
;B[rk]
;W[sk]
;B[sl]
;W[si]
;B[rl]
;W[ni]
;B[oj]
;W[mf]
;B[le]
;W[ki]
;B[hm]
;W[sb]
;B[qd]
;W[sd]
;B[mh]
;W[nh]
;B[nf]
;W[mg]
;B[og]
;W[oh]
;B[da]
;W[cb]
;B[ca]
;W[ba]
;B[ea]
;W[bb]
;B[ie]
;W[gf]
;B[om]
;W[nm]
;B[ra]
;W[dn]
;B[do]
;W[gn]
;B[ls]
;W[gl]
;B[gk]
;W[hl]
;B[ik]
;W[il]
;B[jl]
;W[ms]
;B[lr]
;W[lj]
;B[mj]
;W[mi]
;B[ji]
;W[jh]
;B[kj]
;W[li]
;B[hi]
;W[gh]
;B[mk]
;W[ol]
;B[pl]C[F4 better.]
;W[fp]
;B[fo]
;W[go]
;B[dl]
;W[dk]
;B[en]
;W[al]
;B[of]
;W[ok]
;B[pn]
;W[oo]
;B[dl]
;W[dm]
;B[ns]
;W[mq]
;B[jf]
;W[jg]
;B[ij]
;W[ih]
;B[pk]
;W[ep]
;B[nk]
;W[nn]
;B[dn]
;W[dq]
;B[dr]
;W[ke]
;B[dl]
;W[es]
;B[ds]
;W[dm]
;B[nj]
;W[dl]
;B[]
;W[])
(;B[io]
;W[ho]
;B[jm]))
(;B[qe]C[just take the initative ]))
(;B[ed]
;W[ef]
;B[ff]
;W[eg]
;B[cd]C[that's better maybe?]))
(;B[qe]C[take some intitative i think.])
(;B[fc]C[or go here to exploit the thinness later. ]))
(;B[ch]C[stilla key point i think. ]))
(;B[ch]C[key point for attack. see variation underneath. I think c12 and c14 area vital point for both sides. ])
(;B[]
;W[cf]C[White would like to go here too. ]))
(;B[io]
;W[ho]
;B[jm]
;W[jn]
;B[in]
;W[im]
;B[jl]
(;W[jo]
;B[ip]
;W[ln]
;B[hm]
;W[il]
;B[ik]
;W[hl]
;B[gm]C[white looks screwed h3 and h9 miai ])
(;W[gm]
;B[kn]
;W[fm])))
(;B[jn]C[f3 not alive yet.]))
(;B[mp]
;W[np]
;B[mo]
(;W[lr]
;B[no])
(;W[no]
;B[mq])))
(;B[mp]
(;W[fm]
;B[gm]
(;W[en]
;B[fl]
;W[em]
;B[gn]
;W[fo]
;B[fp]
;W[go]
;B[gp]
;W[ho]
;B[gq])
(;W[gn]
;B[em]
;W[fl]
;B[el]))
(;W[gm]
;B[el]
;W[em]
;B[fm]
;W[fl]
;B[dl]
;W[cl]
;B[fk]
;W[gl]
;B[cm]
;W[cn]
;B[bm]
;W[dn]
;B[bn]
;W[co]
;B[bo]
;W[cp]
;B[cq]))
(;B[dk]C[idk maybe you can pincer like this later on]
;W[el]
;B[gl]
;W[ek]
;B[dj]C[I don't think this could be good for white]))
Overall I think you should focus more on attacking. Gain territory and thickness by attacking. Instead of thinking of just protecting yourself think of how you can protect yourself by attacking. I didn't feel like white got pressured at all in the game. You have to take the imitative and attack. Other than that read better but I guess you can solve that by doing go problems.
Re: Self review of 5 stone game - Comments greatly appreciat
Posted: Tue Oct 29, 2013 2:00 pm
by illluck
@Pippen: Many thanks for the comment. I'm not a fan of move 10 either (I think I proposed attaching instead), but I'm not sure letting white seal outside in sente is better.
@Eizero: Really appreciate your comments! They really demonstrate why comments by stronger players are useful - I didn't even realize I was playing passively until you pointed those moves out! The sequences to break out are also quite interesting - I was trying to find them, but couldn't during the game XD
More comments are of course still welcome, I'd also be happy to answer questions
