JoeS1 wrote:
if you want to ask dan level players for their thoughts on [...] books to get at your level, you get no answer.
While undoubtably this might be so for some dans, other dans have provided and provide answers. E.g., I (5 dan), have given public and private answers, ca. 50 reviews (on books by other authors) and information on go books privately and publicly for 21 years, as far as my time allows. See, e.g.,
http://home.snafu.de/jasiek/isbn.htmlhttp://www.gobooks.info/jasiek/http://home.snafu.de/jasiek/books.htmlQuote:
A lot of people have to resort to books
Yes, and they help a lot. E.g., they were the most important factor for improvement from 10 kyu to 5 dan, among that to 3 dan within 17 months. Do not complain about books but welcome them! :)
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While there are plenty of books around the beginner level, once you start to approach shodan level there become fewer and fewer books to get that help explore and master the basics.
Right, and it gets worse for dan players and especially strong dans.
However, the situation today is very much better than that during the early 90s.
English books for the basics for players approaching 1 dan level:
- Tactical Reading
- Positional Judgement 1 - Territory
- Positional Judgement 2 - Dynamics
- Endgame 1 - Fundamentals
- Fighting Fundamentals
- Joseki 1 - Fundamentals
- Joseki 2 - Strategy
- Joseki 3 - Dictionary
- Capturing Races 1 - Two Basic Groups
- Fuseki Dictionary (Rin Kaiho) (a few volumes)
- Reducing Territorial Frameworks
- First Fundamentals (only if still stuck at 4 kyu or below)
- Lessons in the Fundamentals of Go (for its motivational aspect)
- Fundamental Principles of Go
- Strategic Concepts of Go (aka Basics of Go Strategy)
- Attack and Defense
- various books on life and death (such as All About Life and Death 1 + 2, Life and Death Problems 1 - Basics)
- various books on tesujis
- a book on haengma (I forgot which Korean title was translated)
- etc.
English books (also very suitable) for dans (and partly up to high dans = *):
- Tactical Reading
- Positional Judgement 1 - Territory
- Positional Judgement 2 - Dynamics (*)
- Fighting Fundamentals (*)
- Joseki 2 - Strategy
- Joseki 3 - Dictionary
- Capturing Races 1 - Two Basic Groups (*)
- Fuseki Dictionary (Rin Kaiho) (a few volumes)
- etc. (not many, unfortunately)
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That's what I think is key books that spend the entire book focusing on a concept, like aji, or sabaki, or invasion, etc. So that you can learn and master it. Not like the beginner books that only spend a chapter and a few examples on it.
There are also books for strong players conveying various topics. OC, more often you are right.
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Why aren't they and books like this translated to English for the West?
Because demand is restricted. If everybody bought what they need as books for their improvement, you would see many more English books and translations of Asian books into English.
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Kiseido [...] I haven't read these books, but from the few reviews I've read they aren't very good.
They are books with light and, IMO, too little contents. Reading without investing effort meets the desire of some readers. Players knowing that effort can generate a much greater impact on improvement on average might look for books by other publishers.
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Seems like a no brainer to me to make money.
Go book business is the art of surviving rather than the source of easy money.
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Another thing with intermediate and advanced books, is there aren't very many reviews on them.
Actually, this is so for by far most specialised books on any topics - not just advanced go books. There is only one way out: read and review them! (If you are not strong enough to fully appreciate their contents yet, become a strong dan, then read and review...)
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One or two doesn't really inspire confidence,
What is your problem? There are circa half a dozen of English go book authors. From each, buy the presumably most suitable book for you. Either the author meets, or does not meet, your expectations. If you do not know which would be the most suitable book for you, ask the authors (or publishers).
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especially when you have people around 5kyu to 8kyu typically doing the reviews.
So trust yourself more - read a sample selection of books!
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It would be nice if we had dans regularly reviewing books
Yes, but... As somebody belonging to those dan reviewers, I have to tell you that I only infrequently spend money on books for the sole purpose of reviewing them. The number of new books with relevant contents for me is very small. Nevertheless, I keep an average of circa two go book reviews per year. If you want to see more reviews by (high) dans, a) organise sponsorship for their review copy purchases, b) motivate more authors to write (high) dan contents and c) convince other publishers to provide more review copies to (high) dans.
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that way we had more of a consensus on what books to get at each level,
Consensus will not be reached because opinions differ too greatly.
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how books compare to each other
Read my related opinions, if you can find them.
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and what books really stand out.
By which criteria? :) See, e.g., my rating list but be aware that opinions differ.
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It would be really great if Pros could get a chance to take a look at many of our books and give their recommendations as well.
Didn't Haijin Lee start videos on that? But frankly, a well reasoned review is worth much more than one written by a high rank.
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I know some of the older books from the 60s and 70s were high level
English books? Uhm, only Mathematical Go Endgames, 'Winning Ways' and 'On Numbers and Games', but they are so high level I need to read them twice again to actually understand all the contents;)
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as there is so much knowledge and so many concepts out there on it.
Accurate.
Shenoute wrote:
I don't think there's anything to be learned about go that cannot be learned from older books.
Sorry, but you miss about everything. E.g., roughly 50% of the theory in my 13 books is very important knowledge and cannot be learned from older books. My verbal knowledge contains more than 10 times as much very important knowledge that cannot be learned from older books.