The Intrepid
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by The Intrepid » Mon Aug 27, 2012 2:32 am
@ topazg
Wouldn't White then continue with 7, forcing Black into a less advantageous ko than before?
$$W $$ -------------------------- $$ | . 4 . . . . . . . . . $$ | 5 1 2 X . . . . . . . $$ | 8 3 7 X O . O . . . . $$ | 9 X X O . . . . . X . $$ | 6 X O O . . . . . . . $$ | . O . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$W $$ -------------------------- $$ | . 4 . . . . . . . . . $$ | 5 1 2 X . . . . . . . $$ | 8 3 7 X O . O . . . . $$ | 9 X X O . . . . . X . $$ | 6 X O O . . . . . . . $$ | . O . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$[/go]
Ontological imperative holds that my losses occurred only in imagination.
topazg
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by topazg » Mon Aug 27, 2012 2:43 am
@intrepid:
Quite right. I was thinking Black has miai, but he should probably take
in yours first.
$$W $$ -------------------------- $$ | . 4 . a . . . . . . . $$ | 5 1 2 X . . . . . . . $$ | . 3 6 X O . O . . . . $$ | . X X O . . . . . X . $$ | . X O O . . . . . . . $$ | . O . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$W $$ -------------------------- $$ | . 4 . a . . . . . . . $$ | 5 1 2 X . . . . . . . $$ | . 3 6 X O . O . . . . $$ | . X X O . . . . . X . $$ | . X O O . . . . . . . $$ | . O . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$[/go]Because of "a", I'm struggling to see how White can restrict Black's liberties enough to create a ko..
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by The Intrepid » Mon Aug 27, 2012 3:00 am
@topazg
This should work, it seems:
$$W $$ -------------------------- $$ | . 4 . 7 . . . . . . . $$ | 5 1 2 X 8 9 . . . . . $$ | . 3 6 X O . O . . . . $$ | . X X O . . . . . X . $$ | . X O O . . . . . . . $$ | . O . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$W $$ -------------------------- $$ | . 4 . 7 . . . . . . . $$ | 5 1 2 X 8 9 . . . . . $$ | . 3 6 X O . O . . . . $$ | . X X O . . . . . X . $$ | . X O O . . . . . . . $$ | . O . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$[/go]$$B $$ -------------------------- $$ | . X . O 1 . . . . . . $$ | O O X X X O . . . . . $$ | . O X X O . O . . . . $$ | 2 X X O . . . . . X . $$ | . X O O . . . . . . . $$ | . O . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$B $$ -------------------------- $$ | . X . O 1 . . . . . . $$ | O O X X X O . . . . . $$ | . O X X O . O . . . . $$ | 2 X X O . . . . . X . $$ | . X O O . . . . . . . $$ | . O . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$[/go]Edit: Never mind, this does not work ... hmm
Last edited by
The Intrepid on Mon Aug 27, 2012 3:02 am, edited 1 time in total.
Ontological imperative holds that my losses occurred only in imagination.
topazg
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by topazg » Mon Aug 27, 2012 3:02 am
@Intrepid:
Are you sure?
$$B $$ -------------------------- $$ | a X b O 1 . . . . . . $$ | O O X X X O . . . . . $$ | . O X X O . O . . . . $$ | 2 X X O . . . . . X . $$ | 3 X O O . . . . . . . $$ | . O . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$B $$ -------------------------- $$ | a X b O 1 . . . . . . $$ | O O X X X O . . . . . $$ | . O X X O . O . . . . $$ | 2 X X O . . . . . X . $$ | 3 X O O . . . . . . . $$ | . O . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$[/go]Now what? White can't play at "a", and so after "b" Black is unconditionally alive?
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by The Intrepid » Mon Aug 27, 2012 3:03 am
Ontological imperative holds that my losses occurred only in imagination.
topazg
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by topazg » Mon Aug 27, 2012 3:34 am
Hehe
$$B $$ -------------------------- $$ | . X 2 3 . . . . . . . $$ | O O X X 4 . . . . . . $$ | a O 1 X O . O . . . . $$ | 5 X X O . . . . . X . $$ | . X O O . . . . . . . $$ | . O . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$B $$ -------------------------- $$ | . X 2 3 . . . . . . . $$ | O O X X 4 . . . . . . $$ | a O 1 X O . O . . . . $$ | 5 X X O . . . . . X . $$ | . X O O . . . . . . . $$ | . O . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$[/go]Even this is obviously alive, as White can't play at "a", and Black can.
EDIT: ok, an obvious ko: $$B $$ -------------------------- $$ | . X 2 3 . . . . . . . $$ | O O X X 6 . . . . . . $$ | 7 O 1 X O . O . . . . $$ | 4 X X O . . . . . X . $$ | 5 X O O . . . . . . . $$ | . O . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$B $$ -------------------------- $$ | . X 2 3 . . . . . . . $$ | O O X X 6 . . . . . . $$ | 7 O 1 X O . O . . . . $$ | 4 X X O . . . . . X . $$ | 5 X O O . . . . . . . $$ | . O . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$[/go]However, this is a two step approach ko, so timing is difficult. I can't see a better way for White, but there may be one (mitsun is a lot stronger than I am).
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by The Intrepid » Mon Aug 27, 2012 3:47 am
Ontological imperative holds that my losses occurred only in imagination.
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by Magicwand » Mon Aug 27, 2012 5:53 am
R15 PEEP
"The more we think we know about
The greater the unknown"
Words by neil peart, music by geddy lee and alex lifeson
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by mitsun » Mon Aug 27, 2012 12:19 pm
Topazg & Intrepid
I think the problem is symmetric -- B can play either way and W gets an approach move ko. In your sequence, W does not have to prevent B from playing (a) or throw-in to force B to play (a).
$$W $$ -------------------------- $$ | . 4 . a . . . . . . . $$ | 5 1 2 X . . . . . . . $$ | . 3 6 X O . O . . . . $$ | . X X O . . . . . X . $$ | . X O O . . . . . . . $$ | . O . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$W $$ -------------------------- $$ | . 4 . a . . . . . . . $$ | 5 1 2 X . . . . . . . $$ | . 3 6 X O . O . . . . $$ | . X X O . . . . . X . $$ | . X O O . . . . . . . $$ | . O . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$[/go]$$W $$ -------------------------- $$ | . X . 2 5 . . . . . . $$ | O O X X 1 . . . . . . $$ | . O X X O . O . . . . $$ | 3 X X O . . . . . X . $$ | 4 X O O . . . . . . . $$ | . O . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$W $$ -------------------------- $$ | . X . 2 5 . . . . . . $$ | O O X X 1 . . . . . . $$ | . O X X O . O . . . . $$ | 3 X X O . . . . . X . $$ | 4 X O O . . . . . . . $$ | . O . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$[/go]