Go9dan.com

[hyperpape]

I've never found it since then, but I swear I heard Andy tell some (strong) pro he played on KGS that he needed two stones to play even. I wanted to say it was An Youngil, but a little time with KGS analytics and grep suggests that's not true. Andy has gotten a bit stronger since then, but probably not a whole stone, and Lee is stronger than whomever this pro was.

[topazg]

Andy has played Lee Changho in a tournament environment over 2 games, so that's probably still a reasonable yardstick even though it was some time ago

[CnP]

Given that you have to pay to play, I'm not sure that it's for me.

yeh, my first reaction was - pay to play won't work outside Asia since we expect free Go and have the likes of KGS, IGS & Kaya.gs .. but reading the description I did think it might (work and be for me..). It seems like a good way to get experience playing stronger players without the social awkwardness of asking for a favor - perhaps that's the students fault but I can see people going for it. Membership is $10 or $20 per month, so not huge. Also there's a more general impression I get that it could create an environment for people to start making more money from Go - so might be good for the US pros.. Who knows though - fingers crossed.

[Mef]

How can something this big just come out of nowhere?!

I am aroused by skeptical. Multiple forms of currency. Free accounts don't seem to be have much functionality.

I would guess they initially developed a business model, approached sponsors, etc prior to any public release of a product....Pretty much standard fare for a typical commercial venture. They likely had investors who liked their plan for monetization, and were willing to fund the development and launch tournament. I think it will be worth keeping an eye on.

[palapiku]

hahaha

Either you pay $20 a month, which is rather ridiculous
Or you pay $10 a month, which is still ridiculous, in which case you also have to pay extra to:
* use automatch
* watch 9d games
* use the score estimator
* search for a user

This is frankly offensive.

[Magicwand]

I've never found it since then, but I swear I heard Andy tell some (strong) pro he played on KGS that he needed two stones to play even. I wanted to say it was An Youngil, but a little time with KGS analytics and grep suggests that's not true. Andy has gotten a bit stronger since then, but probably not a whole stone, and Lee is stronger than whomever this pro was.

his name was Kim sung yong

[hyperpape]

I think you're thinking of the time Andy told Kim that he'd give Kim 2 handi, right after winning. A bit rude (and completely unwarranted) but he was responding to Kim having said the same to Zhaonian Chen.

Alas, I still haven't found it.

[lovelove]

This website is made together by Lee Sedol 9p and John Lee, Korean ex-insei currently doing IT business.

http://www.tygem.com/news/news/viewpage ... &findword=

Above link is a Korean article about this from Tygem.


Below sentences are from the article, said by John Lee.

영어권 국가에서는 KGS 및 IGS라는 바둑사이트가 있는데, 이는 한국의 대표사이트에 비해 기능적인 면과 질적인 면에서 많이 떨어집니다. 국내 몇몇 바둑 사이트에서도 해외 보급을 위해 영문 사이트를 제작하여 서비스를 하고 있지만 언어 및 문화적인 벽을 넘지 못하여 사용자가 미비한 수준에 그치고 있습니다. 이에 한국의 대표사이트에 비해 기능적인 부분이나 서비스의 질을 높인 사이트를 만들고자 시작했다

(Translation) <-- not good translation, done by me
There are KGS and IGS in the English speaking world, but they are inferior in quality and functionality comparing to Korean go servers (Tygem, Oro). Some of Korean go servers made a english client, but there aren't many users, for language and cultural difference. So we wanted to make a high quality English go server.

[p2501]

Didn't Lee Sedol take a break from pro baduk for a while over some differences with the Hanguk Kiwon, including the rights to games played? As far as I can tell, you can buy kifu from games that other players played on go9dan.com.

Seems a bit odd.

[lovelove]

Didn't Lee Sedol take a break from pro baduk for a while over some differences with the Hanguk Kiwon, including the rights to games played? As far as I can tell, you can buy kifu from games that other players played on go9dan.com.

Seems a bit odd.

For the rights of kifus, Lee Sedol agreed with most, but he didn't like the attitude of Korean Kiwon. More detailed situations are written in his books "Commentated games of Lee Sedol" and "판을 엎어라 (Turn Over the Board)". I read both books few years ago from a library, but I don't remember most.

[Bonobo]

Anybody care to say something about the opinions of Lee Sedol, the Korean Kiwon and others regarding the rights to games played?

Thanks in advance

Tom

[karaklis]

There are KGS and IGS in the English speaking world, but they are inferior in quality and functionality comparing to Korean go servers (Tygem, Oro).

LOL. Interesting opinion, but I assume that most go players in the west wouldn't share this. KGS e.g. has an excellent functionality for reviewing games. Oro & Tygem have some completely useless functions (concerning playing go) such like "betting".

Some of Korean go servers made a english client, but there aren't many users, for language and cultural difference.

The clients are probably the reason where there aren't many users.

[snorri]

There are KGS and IGS in the English speaking world, but they are inferior in quality and functionality comparing to Korean go servers (Tygem, Oro).

LOL. Interesting opinion, but I assume that most go players in the west wouldn't share this. KGS e.g. has an excellent functionality for reviewing games. Oro & Tygem have some completely useless functions (concerning playing go) such like "betting".

I suppose it's possible an online gambling company would look at the absense of betting on KGS and IGS and consider it to be seriously diminished functionality. Tygem is terrible for game recorders.

Do the same people think TOM is inferior, too?

Some of Korean go servers made a english client, but there aren't many users, for language and cultural difference.

The clients are probably the reason where there aren't many users.

I agree. Even assuming they are correct that the language and cultural differences are the key factors limiting Tygem and WBaduk (Oro) use in the West, what is Go9dan.com going to do to solve those issues? Is the idea that cultural and language differences will disappear because they don't expect Asian players to play there? If so, then one of the main advantages of Tygem and WBaduk---the fact that a large number of players are usually online (including strong ones)---will not be an advantage for Go9dan.com. Remember that one of the reasons people were skeptical of Kaya was that it is hard to boostrap a loyal user base.

[lovelove]

There are KGS and IGS in the English speaking world, but they are inferior in quality and functionality comparing to Korean go servers (Tygem, Oro).

LOL. Interesting opinion, but I assume that most go players in the west wouldn't share this. KGS e.g. has an excellent functionality for reviewing games. Oro & Tygem have some completely useless functions (concerning playing go) such like "betting".

I suppose it's possible an online gambling company would look at the absense of betting on KGS and IGS and consider it to be seriously diminished functionality. Tygem is terrible for game recorders.

Do the same people think TOM is inferior, too?

Some of Korean go servers made a english client, but there aren't many users, for language and cultural difference.

The clients are probably the reason where there aren't many users.

I agree. Even assuming they are correct that the language and cultural differences are the key factors limiting Tygem and WBaduk (Oro) use in the West, what is Go9dan.com going to do to solve those issues? Is the idea that cultural and language differences will disappear because they don't expect Asian players to play there? If so, then one of the main advantages of Tygem and WBaduk---the fact that a large number of players are usually online (including strong ones)---will not be an advantage for Go9dan.com. Remember that one of the reasons people were skeptical of Kaya was that it is hard to boostrap a loyal user base.

Maybe I used the word "inferior" wrong.

Anyway, betting is very important for Korean users. In Korean go clubs (kiwon), there are always bets for playing a game, usually 5,000 ~ 100,000 won (1 USD = 1074 won) per game or 10 point win. So it is also very normal to have bets in online play.

For the game reviewing function, I want to ask if there are some problems in the English client of Tygem and Oro. I never had trouble in reviewing my games in those servers, and also there is a better score estimator than the KGS one.

I once read a interview with Kim Seongryong 9p when he was playing in KGS as "hemmy". He said that he felt like playing in a ten years outdated go server while playing in KGS. I somehow agree with this. Maybe it's just because I'm not used to KGS interface.

[karaklis]

He said that he felt like playing in a ten years outdated go server while playing in KGS. I somehow agree with this. Maybe it's just because I'm not used to KGS interface.

That is definitely true. But a modern look does not necessarily mean that it is better (in functionality). I like the classic board and was extremely put off by the flickering avatars of Oro's (Wbaduk's) client. To each their own.