Which Joseki Does This Come From?

logan · Post by **logan** » Mon Sep 16, 2013 1:44 am

This is a position from a book I'm studying. So far all the positions have come from natural/common situations and joseki deviations, but I'm not sure where this one comes from.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Bm1 Unknown diagram $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . O O . . . . . . . . $$ | . X X O . . . . . . . $$ | . O O X X . . . . . . $$ | . . X O . . . . . , . $$ | . . X O . X . . . . . $$ | . . X O . O X . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ ----------------------[/go]

My best guess for how part of the diagram come about is this:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Wm1 $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . 6 9 . . . . . . . $$ | . 7 5 8 0 . . . . . . $$ | . . 4 1 . . . . . , . $$ | . . 2 3 . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ ----------------------[/go]

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Wm11 Cont. 1 $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . 3 1 . . . . . . . . $$ | . 2 X O . . . . . . . $$ | . O O X X . . . . . . $$ | . . X O . . . . . , . $$ | . . X O . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ ----------------------[/go]

I'm not sure how the others got there, except this is the result:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Bm11 Cont. 1 $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . O O . . . . . . . . $$ | . X X O . . . . . . . $$ | . O O X X . . . . . . $$ | . . X O . . . . . , . $$ | . . X O . 1 . . . . . $$ | . . Y Q . 2 3 . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ ----------------------[/go]

BTW, the problem goes on the say that White continues with

when she should have played A first. The question is, how does Black punish?

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Bm1 Problem $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ | . O O . . . . . . . . $$ | . X X O . . . . . . . $$ | . O O X X . . . . . . $$ | . Q X O . . . . . , . $$ | . . X O . X . . . . . $$ | . . X O a O X . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . $$ ----------------------[/go]

Answer:

MJK · Post by **MJK** » Mon Sep 16, 2013 2:01 am

my guess

ez4u · Post by **ez4u** » Mon Sep 16, 2013 5:56 am

MJK's line looks like a good guess. In GoGoD we do not see any games where this position occurs. My copy of the Igo Daijiten contains a couple of diagrams on the continuation when Black plays the atari at 8 in MJK's diagram. All the lines continue with Black 14 at 15 so we never arrive at the position shown. In actual play, as demonstrated by GoGoD, Black usually plays 8 at 15. On occasion Black plays 8 at 12 instead. There are 24 games with these two lines, played between 1927 and 2011.

logan · Post by **logan** » Mon Sep 16, 2013 11:37 am

MJK wrote:my guess

dddr.png

That looks reasonable -- although I think it's still a strange sequence -- thank-you.

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Which Joseki Does This Come From?

Which Joseki Does This Come From?

Re: Which Joseki Does This Come From?

Re: Which Joseki Does This Come From?

Re: Which Joseki Does This Come From?