Games as audio?

[̄̄̄̄]

Has anyone here tried listening to a game of go? Have the coordinates read out and try to keep track of the game in your head. I thought this might be fun to try. Maybe a good exercise to help your visualization?

I doubt I could get very far into a game before completely falling apart.

I'm fiddling with text to speech programs right now, trying to find something that sounds ok. Not sure what the best way to format this.

[RBerenguel]

I've tried replaying 9x9 games from raw SGF, and even played against gnugo "blind." It's damn hard, reading it with "infinite" time. Only hearing it is probably impossibly hard.

[̄̄̄̄]

That's my gut feeling too. Even the coordinates are a bit of a stumbling block for me.. If you ask me where is H12? It takes longer that it ought to place that stone in my head. Maybe I'll try using audio to play some games out on a board first. That seems like it would be easy enough, and a logical baby step.

Now if I could only get this stupid program working... apparently all text to speech programs are hot piles of garbage.

[RBerenguel]

That's my gut feeling too. Even the coordinates are a bit of a stumbling block for me.. If you ask me where is H12? It takes longer that it ought to place that stone in my head. Maybe I'll try using audio to play some games out on a board first. That seems like it would be easy enough, and a logical baby step.

Now if I could only get this stupid program working... apparently all text to speech programs are hot piles of garbage.

Try 9x9 games. Even in 9x9, determining where ee (SGF formatted, which is the most straightforward way to get coordinates out of a game) is non-trivial at first. Imagine jk or sk!

[TheBigH]

It would be easier if the moves were announced descriptively. Example (of a contrived weird opening),

"Black, star point, top right corner."
"White, 3-4 point, bottom left corner, left side."
"Black, 4-5 point, top left corner, left side."
"White, tengen."
"Black, low approach to bottom left corner."
"White, one space low pincer."
"Black, one space jump."

It's much easier to immediately visualize where those seven stones are than if I'd said

"Q16 C4 D15 K10 E3 G3 E5"

[foe]

"Q16 C4 D15 K10 E3 G3 E5"

The coordinates are much easier for me to position and properly visualize a game without the aid of a board. If you use just the words describing the moves I won't be able to follow well. I would likely end up getting the corners mixed up. I usually prefer a pure numerical description though. No letters.

[Splatted]

I believe there is a system where the board is divided in to 4 (horizontally and vertically, not diagonally) and then moves in each quadrant are described by their relationship to the corner. e.g.

$$c This is a label for the diagram.
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 1 . . . . . , . . . . 2 . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$c This is a label for the diagram.
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 1 . . . . . , . . . . 2 . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

might be a4-4, b5-4 b4-5

[Uberdude]

I believe there is a system where the board is divided in to 4 (horizontally and vertically, not diagonally) and then moves in each quadrant are described by their relationship to the corner.

[sl=AudouardCoordinates]Audouard Coordinates[/sl]

[TheBigH]

"Q16 C4 D15 K10 E3 G3 E5"

The coordinates are much easier for me to position and properly visualize a game without the aid of a board. If you use just the words describing the moves I won't be able to follow well. I would likely end up getting the corners mixed up. I usually prefer a pure numerical description though. No letters.

I guess my brain doesn't work that way. It's easier for me to visualize the position of the stones based on a description of their function, than listing their coordinates. If you say to me "Q-16 or 16-16" I have to count the rows and columns mentally, and then I think "Oh, star point" anyway.

I believe there is a system where the board is divided in to 4 (horizontally and vertically, not diagonally) and then moves in each quadrant are described by their relationship to the corner.

[sl=AudouardCoordinates]Audouard Coordinates[/sl]

This coordinate system seems to have been invented independently many times before. I think it's similar to the old Chinese notation, and this strange, but rather charming, old book details a notation that's essentially the same.

[daal]

I once tried to practice josekis like that and kept on stumbling over whether to say 3-4 or 4-3 etc.

[EdLee]

Another name for it is blind Go -- is it similar ? (Featured in one episode of Hikaru.)

There are some players with visual impairment and one way is to use
a special "braille"-like board so they can physically feel
the exact locations of the stones.

I heard there is at least one man in China (maybe the only person in the world?)
who can play blind Go at pro level. (His vision is normal, AFAIK.) I don't know
if he played blind Go audially (like Akira), or by touch with a "braille"-like set up.

[mipli]

I remember once trying to play blind go on a bus where we didn't have a board available. We played a 9x9 game and just gave numerical coordinates from the bottom-left corner. We managed to finish the first game, since we played nicely and just divided the board in two. The second game became chaos after the first cross cut so we gave up after that.

One colour go is much easier though. As long as you keep your full attention on the board it is usually possible to finish a game on 9x9 and 13x13 at least, never tried on 19x19.

I heard there is at least one man in China (maybe the only person in the world?)
who can play blind Go at pro level. (His vision is normal, AFAIK.) I don't know
if he played blind Go audially (like Akira), or by touch with a "braille"-like set up.

I think you're thinking about Bao Yun. He's playing the games by just hearing the coordinates, he even manages to play simultaneous games like that all the way into the end game. There as a mention of him in American Go E-Journal last year as well. I've heard it mentioned that he has won against pros while blindfolded as well, but I couldn't find any sources for that so not sure if that was just exaggeration or not.

[EdLee]

I think you're thinking about Bao Yun. ... I've heard it mentioned that he has won against pros while blindfolded as well,
but I couldn't find any sources for that so not sure if that was just exaggeration or not.

Thanks, mipli, yes, it is Bao⁴ Yun². He is amateur 6 dan in China,
and he (obviously) has this special ability to play blind Go, at near his true level (amateur 6 dan).
I also don't know if he's ever beat a pro playing blind himself (with the pro playing normally).
But we know for sure he can play blind Go at or near his true level, which is very impressive indeed.