Go problem from my game tonight

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wessanenoctupus
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Go problem from my game tonight

Post by wessanenoctupus »

Black to live

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go] [/go]
wessanenoctupus
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Re: Go problem from my game tonight

Post by wessanenoctupus »

well escape...
phillip1882
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Re: Go problem from my game tonight

Post by phillip1882 »

o18 looks like the move to me, i don't see how white can kill black after that but i maybe mistaken.
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Re: Go problem from my game tonight

Post by sybob »

do you also provide solution?
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Joelnelsonb
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Re: Go problem from my game tonight

Post by Joelnelsonb »

Black can't play o18 because white would play p17 and escape.

I don't see a way for black to survive without inferior play from white.
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ez4u
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Re: Go problem from my game tonight

Post by ez4u »

How about the sequence below? All White's responses seem forced to prevent Black making a second eye. Black next connects at 'a' and has broken out. The key point is that there isn't space for a second eye in the corner but there seems to be just enough potential that Black can use to drive White along the way.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 6 2 O 3 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . 5 1 . X X . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . O . X . X 4 O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O O O 7 8 0 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O a 9 O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Dave Sigaty
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drmwc
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Re: Go problem from my game tonight

Post by drmwc »

Dave's reply seems to work.

This also occurred to me:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 9 8 0 . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 O a . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . 5 4 . X X . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . O . X 6 X . O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O O O 7 . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . 1 O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Next black plays at a, sacrifices some bits and gets a living shape in the corner. White has other replies e.g.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . X X . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . O . X . X . O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O O O 2 3 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O 6 1 O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 4 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Next:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm7
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . X X . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . O . X . X 7 O 9 |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O O O O X 6 5 8 |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O 1 3 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 . 4 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


And black seems to get a ko at least, so Dave's line is cleaner.
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ez4u
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Re: Go problem from my game tonight

Post by ez4u »

drmwc wrote:Dave's reply seems to work.

This also occurred to me:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 9 8 0 . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 O a . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . 5 4 . X X . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . O . X 6 X . O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O O O 7 . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . 1 O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Next black plays at a, sacrifices some bits and gets a living shape in the corner...

Doesn't Black just solidly connect and capture 5 White stones 4 liberties to 3? ;-)
Dave Sigaty
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skydyr
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Re: Go problem from my game tonight

Post by skydyr »

ez4u wrote:
drmwc wrote:Dave's reply seems to work.

This also occurred to me:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 9 8 0 . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 O a . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . 5 4 . X X . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . O . X 6 X . O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O O O 7 . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . 1 O O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Next black plays at a, sacrifices some bits and gets a living shape in the corner...

Doesn't Black just solidly connect and capture 5 White stones 4 liberties to 3? ;-)


Looks a bit like the 19-point trick play to me... Black gets a reasonable number of points in the corner, but white has forcing moves to seal him in painfully. White starts with the point below :b7: and then takes two moves on the left to force black to play inside for the semeai, and white seals black in sente.
Uberdude
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Re: Go problem from my game tonight

Post by Uberdude »

skydyr wrote:Looks a bit like the 19-point trick play to me... Black gets a reasonable number of points in the corner, but white has forcing moves to seal him in painfully.


Did you forget that in the 19-point trickplay both sides have played the same number of moves, but in this one white has 6 more stones?
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