[admin] Moved to the game analysis subforum. -JB [/admin]
Hi, if anyone could give me some pointers I would really appreciate it.
This is a game I played recently on KGS. I felt like the opening was going pretty well, but I seemed to lose it in the middle game (admittedly I did make a couple of mistakes).
Perhaps the 3-3 invasion at B39 was a mistake?
Review please?
-
EdLee
- Honinbo
- Posts: 8859
- Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 6:49 pm
- GD Posts: 312
- Location: Santa Barbara, CA
- Has thanked: 349 times
- Been thanked: 2070 times
Hi wilswan,
After this, probably a good idea to look at a few of the most basic continuations of the joseki. Not a must; but if you enjoy it, it's nice.
For example, D4 is one continuation for this common shape (and W normally replies at E3; B takes 3-3 -- standard local sequence. )
E3. 
Strange. Maybe jealous. Instead, approaching from any other wider sides seems quite reasonable.
.. 
Reasonable sequence for B.
Ah, this one. Letting W connect his 2 weak groups like this is soft on W, too easy on W. Trying to split W should be the first feeling; fighting spirit.
Example: B15.
Mistake. W already got away with murder here because of ,
and B voluntarily ended in gote. W is happy to tenuki.
Later, W has B18 clamp as follow-up. This move kills that option for W.
Feels slow. Tenuki. Example: R6.
Peaceful choice. OK. If you're worried about the bottom, you can consider O4 -- some variations.
Follow-itis ( term stolen from Bill. )
Questions to ask: 
This area is neutral ( or, should be, unless you force W to make it cash. )
Still the same questions as .
- 
This exchange could be bad for B. 
Follow-itis. The bottom.
More than one fire now. Locally, o16 to break into W.
Globally, the bottom.
Follow-itis. Same notes as .
See - above.
T3 atari, then maybe 
P9 or o8 to fix the shape.
Seems unreasonable/greedy. W already played too softly. J4.
J4.
J4.
H6.
K2. ( ... was bad. )
101 G1.
After this, probably a good idea to look at a few of the most basic continuations of the joseki. Not a must; but if you enjoy it, it's nice. For example, D4 is one continuation for this common shape (and W normally replies at E3; B takes 3-3 -- standard local sequence. ) E3. Strange. Maybe jealous. Instead, approaching from any other wider sides seems quite reasonable. .. Reasonable sequence for B. Ah, this one. Letting W connect his 2 weak groups like this is soft on W, too easy on W. Trying to split W should be the first feeling; fighting spirit.Example: B15.
Mistake. W already got away with murder here because of ,and B voluntarily ended in gote. W is happy to tenuki.
Later, W has B18 clamp as follow-up. This move kills that option for W.
Feels slow. Tenuki. Example: R6. Peaceful choice. OK. If you're worried about the bottom, you can consider O4 -- some variations. Follow-itis ( term stolen from Bill. )Questions to ask:
? This area is neutral ( or, should be, unless you force W to make it cash. )Still the same questions as
. - This exchange could be bad for B. Follow-itis. The bottom. More than one fire now. Locally, o16 to break into W.Globally, the bottom.
Follow-itis. Same notes as . See - above. T3 atari, then maybe P9 or o8 to fix the shape. Seems unreasonable/greedy. W already played too softly. J4. J4. J4. H6. K2. ( ... was bad. ) 101 G1.-
TegaiS
- Lives with ko
- Posts: 153
- Joined: Wed Jan 26, 2011 2:02 am
- GD Posts: 0
- Universal go server handle: tegais
- Location: Russia, Krasnoyarsk, (GMT+07:00)
- Has thanked: 1 time
- Been thanked: 18 times
Re: Review please?
Learn how to stop a large monkey jump (White's 120) and you will become stronger by half a stone immediately.
I don't think B39 was a mistake but I think that White was better at this point already.
One general advice for this game is to play further from the strong groups (sometimes even as far as possible). It can be applied to Black moves 15 (better at the right side, for example R6), 31 (the same), 45--53, 69 (M3 looks more promising). It can be difficult to determine whether the group is strong or not but if you think that it is strong play away from it.
I don't think B39 was a mistake but I think that White was better at this point already.
One general advice for this game is to play further from the strong groups (sometimes even as far as possible). It can be applied to Black moves 15 (better at the right side, for example R6), 31 (the same), 45--53, 69 (M3 looks more promising). It can be difficult to determine whether the group is strong or not but if you think that it is strong play away from it.
-
Uberdude
- Judan
- Posts: 6727
- Joined: Thu Nov 24, 2011 11:35 am
- Rank: UK 4 dan
- GD Posts: 0
- KGS: Uberdude 4d
- OGS: Uberdude 7d
- Location: Cambridge, UK
- Has thanked: 436 times
- Been thanked: 3718 times
Re: Review please?
Actually I think white's monkey jump is not legitimate as the group it is jumping from is not fully alive yet. If white insists on saving it isn't this a kill? First reduce the white eyespace in sente, note black doesn't need to defend the lower left territory for now as white can't make an eye by going that way. Then peep of 8 makes eyespace smaller and prevents connection out. White can try falling back to eye point but doesn't help EDIT: Oops, didn't notice that black is short of liberties this way too when drawing diagrams: END EDITTegaiS wrote:Learn how to stop a large monkey jump (White's 120) and you will become stronger by half a stone immediately.
However, white's 2 corner stones might save the day with tesuji of 9 (if black plays atari at 11 then white can make ko)? Note how getting the hane at 11 means the black a16 becomes a self-atari so can no longer connect to a14 peep. If you play a17 hane instead of a18 belly tesuji then black can block at a18 and maintains the threat of connection to a14. In which case black could think about starting at a16 instead of e13. I didn't finish reading this but I should think black might be able to capture those 2 stones in exchange for letting white connect out with f12, which is a territorial gain for black. The moral of the story is don't just think about endgame because you opponent played an endgame move, think about life and death too. Learn to do this and become 5 stones stronger
.-
wilswan
- Beginner
- Posts: 2
- Joined: Fri Aug 19, 2016 1:31 am
- Rank: KGS 11k
- GD Posts: 0
- Universal go server handle: wilswan
Re: Review please?
Wow, thanks very much guys, I'll look through this and try to bear it in mind in future.
-
Bill Spight
- Honinbo
- Posts: 10905
- Joined: Wed Apr 21, 2010 1:24 pm
- Has thanked: 3651 times
- Been thanked: 3373 times
Re: Review please?
Some comments.
The Adkins Principle:
At some point, doesn't thinking have to go on?
— Winona Adkins
Visualize whirled peas.
Everything with love. Stay safe.
At some point, doesn't thinking have to go on?
— Winona Adkins
Visualize whirled peas.
Everything with love. Stay safe.
-
Fedya
- Lives in gote
- Posts: 603
- Joined: Tue Apr 20, 2010 8:21 pm
- Rank: 6-7k KGS
- GD Posts: 0
- Has thanked: 43 times
- Been thanked: 139 times
Re: Review please?
No offense, but it's nice to see strong players miss things like this when reading.EDIT: Oops, didn't notice that black is short of liberties this way too when drawing diagrams:
(I know that's not a valid excuse for my own lousy reading.)