Nihon Ki-in announce World Go Championship including Zen AI

[John Fairbairn]

What I meant about artificial tie-break might not be familiar to everyone.

As I understand the numbers, in a 4-person round robin it is possible to have three players on 2-1 and one on 0-3.

In such cases (including in bigger ties in bigger "leagues" or round robins), the usual Japanese practice has long been to resort to the Paramus ladder system where the two lowest-ranked players play off first, then the winner plays the next player on the ranking list, and so on - a version of the win & continue or last-man-standing principle.

I consider this artificial because the ranking is based on performances outside the round robin - most typically on previous performances in previous terms of the event, but sometimes on dan grade. That seems quite impossible in this case. Drawing lots is even more artificial.

Incidentally, and no doubt a sign of the times, I see they will play right through without a break even, apparently, for lunch. The rumbling tum tesuji won't affect against DeepZenGo but it might work on the humans.

[RobertJasiek]

The cyclic tie issue is of central importance indeed. Easiest solution: share the first place. Second best: mini multiple-instance round-robin among the tied persons until a single winner emerges, if necessary with reduced (or decreasing) thinking times. Third best: as before, but after a specified number of instances and persisting ties, share the first place. Second worst: use tiebreakers for a KO pairing among the tied players. Worst: use some arbitrary tiebreaker lottery.

[Javaness2]

Super happy to see this event being created.

[pookpooi]

Remi just registered CrazyStone to participate in UEC Cup in 18-19 March 2017.
If he win, is it possible that CrazyStone will replace DeepZenGo at World Go Championship.

[Bonobo]

Remi just registered CrazyStone to participate in UEC Cup in 18-19 March 2017.
If he win, is it possible that CrazyStone will replace DeepZenGo at World Go Championship.

Does this question miss a question mark.





Probably because a question mark is missing at the end of your question, I misread your “[..] is it possible [..]” as “[..] it is possible [..]”.

[pookpooi]

Does this question miss a question mark.

Yes, I forget question mark and instead end with full stop?

[trout]

Ke Jie excused himself from this tournament due to scheduling.

[Bonobo]

Ke Jie excused himself from this tournament due to scheduling.

<totally silly comment> <conspiracy theory> Sounds suspiciously similar to the excuse the DeepMind used for AlphaGo not participating </conspiracy theory> </totally silly comment>

[xiayun]

Yeah, more hope for an AlphaGo/KJ match.

The selection process for China will include 8 players: No. 2-7 ranked players + Tang Weixing + Fan Tingyu. So the quality will certainly be there.

[Uberdude]

Interesting RE Ke Jie... As for choosing the Chinese player, whilst a selection tournament is probably the most fair, if they really want to win then taking into consideration the opposing players could increase the win chances, e.g. who has the best record against Park Junghwan? I had some memory Chen Yaoye tended to do well against him but when I checked go4go they are now pretty even (Chen 17 wins 16 loses).

[idontgetit]

Interesting RE Ke Jie... As for choosing the Chinese player, whilst a selection tournament is probably the most fair, if they really want to win then taking into consideration the opposing players could increase the win chances, e.g. who has the best record against Park Junghwan? I had some memory Chen Yaoye tended to do well against him but when I checked go4go they are now pretty even (Chen 17 wins 16 loses).

I remember seeing stats on sina a couple of days ago, where they had stats of players who have won against park before in international tournaments, and while most of them had a less than 50% average as a whole against park, many of them do as well or even significantly better than park when it comes to tournaments in head to head matches.

Anyway, if we are to assume that the AI will win the tournament, then we can always say "well, our top human player didn't participate".

[idontgetit]

Ke Jie just denied rumours that he will be playing alphago during this match.

He also said that playing AlphaGo would be "song si", which literally means "gifting death", basically a phrase you use when you're way weaker than your opponent.

We all thought that AlphaGo is probably quite strong now, but with Ke Jie saying something like this... o_o

http://sports.sina.com.cn/go/2016-12-08 ... 4429.shtml

[hokusai]

He also said that playing AlphaGo would be "song si", which literally means "gifting death", basically a phrase you use when you're way weaker than your opponent.

http://sports.sina.com.cn/go/2016-12-08 ... 4429.shtml

Fascinating indeed..that "song si"..But I believe he made that statement refering to his current "bad" state, didn't he?

[pookpooi]

One (weak) theory is that AlphaGo's opponent will be DeepZenGo, since they can play handicap game to show AlphaGo's 'massively stronger' version (I guess no top pro want to receive handicap stones from AI yet). But only one condition, DeepZenGo has to do well on World Go Championship, either winner or runner-up. Otherwise it'd be bad anchor.

About Ke Jie interview I read through Google translation (thanks deep learning!!) It's strange that he said he's in bad state despite just won Samsung Cup, may be he's worry too much about Bailing cup?

[idontgetit]

One (weak) theory is that AlphaGo's opponent will be DeepZenGo, since they can play handicap game to show AlphaGo's 'massively stronger' version (I guess no top pro want to receive handicap stones from AI yet). But only one condition, DeepZenGo has to do well on World Go Championship, either winner or runner-up. Otherwise it'd be bad anchor.

About Ke Jie interview I read through Google translation (thanks deep learning!!) It's strange that he said he's in bad state despite just won Samsung Cup, may be he's worry too much about Bailing cup?

The neural translations still suck. I tried them a few times. I don't think it employed the latest technology.

Anyway, Ke Jie CLAIMS that he has no more pressure now that he won the samsung cup, because the agon kiriyama game doesn't really matter, if he loses, he'll just be contributing to the friendship between China/Japan (:D), and he already has 2 losses in the Bailing cup so he'll just YOLO it.

And at hokusai: Yes. but honestly, how much can condition do at that level? Not that much. I mean, even if he had a bad condition, he'd be stronger than Cho Chikun. The difference between bot and human is probably not that little.