If I have to buy ONLY 1 book...

[Dante31]

yep, got 400 years. another great book.

and you're right, Invincible shouldn't necessarily be a first book. But the original question was about being an only book.

A beginner first book won't last as an only book. Invincible surely will

What I am trying to stress is that Invincible is not a book beginners buy to get stronger, it is for Dan players.

Here I have to disagree. Some of the best ways to get stronger...
- play stronger players
- study (review/play though) professional games

Sure, a beginner's book may give you a leg up on understanding various concepts and skills and help a complete beginner to progress to regular beginner a little bit faster, but don't completely discount the value of reviewing pro games for any level player.

The original question, more specifically, was about the only 1 book for a beginner. He mentioned that he is a beginner, so it is safe to assume he wants a book for a beginner. It is not a question of 1 book for the rest of ones life.

The fact that a appropriate level book will help progress a little faster is an understatement. Just looking over pro games without any basic technical knowledge is like trying to study calculus before you can multiply and divide. Is it beneficial for a first grader to to look over a calculus books? Could be. Will he learn calculus without learning the basic mathematics? I doubt it.

[CarlJung]

The fact that a appropriate level book will help progress a little faster is an understatement. Just looking over pro games without any basic technical knowledge is like trying to study calculus before you can multiply and divide. Is it beneficial for a first grader to to look over a calculus books? Could be. Will he learn calculus without learning the basic mathematics? I doubt it.

Let me quote the immortal writings of Magicwand in another thread.

i dont want you to learn wrong ideas from kyu level players.(sorry if i offended many)
just memorizing professional games will help you improve and will open your eyes in opening part of the game.
...
hum....when i was ddk many people gave me advice "memorize 100 professional games"
i love to review professional games. i didnt mean to memorize but after good review it was automatically remaind in my brain.
back then i really didnt feel any improvement but now i look back and can see that memorizing professional game really did help me improve faster.

[Dante31]

But still it is coupled with other study materials I am sure. I just don't see how it would be possible for a DDK to look over pro games and learn much without learning the basics. I am sure in the long run as you learn the basics the games you have memorized will start to make sense, but without understanding the basics there is just no meaning behind the moves. For a few hundred moves pro's play in a game, there are thousands that they do not that influence the moves they do play. The benefit is most likely that you memorize pro games beforehand, and use that knowledge when you get to it.

[TimeZero]

The original question, more specifically, was about the only 1 book for a beginner. He mentioned that he is a beginner, so it is safe to assume he wants a book for a beginner. It is not a question of 1 book for the rest of ones life.

Someone has nailed it! But I read all suggestions no matter what. And for those who wondered, I got the hardcover version of Invincible!

Not so. A physical book has a magic of it's own.

I totally agree here!

I am sure you could find pirate copies of almost everything including Invincible if you were to look for it. But it's not only about the information in the book. It is the book itself, touchable and real, with the information in it. This is why I recommend getting the hardcover version. But again, I am not claiming this is a reasonable choice, only that it is my choice.

I did buy a legit copy of Invincible. And I like books in general. I can comfortably read them laying in my bed and it's good sometimes being elsewhere than in front of my screen.

I can't never thank you all enough for all those replies! It's very appreciated! More than I expected!

[oren]

A beginner first book won't last as an only book.

But you can give it to other beginners which makes it more valuable.

[xed_over]

But still it is coupled with other study materials I am sure. I just don't see how it would be possible for a DDK to look over pro games and learn much without learning the basics.

How can a baby learn to speak a language without learning the basics -- verbs, nouns, sentence structure?

They learn by imitating what they hear. Later, the classroom instruction of the basics will bring more clarity to what they've already learned to understand from practical usage.

[Dante31]

But still it is coupled with other study materials I am sure. I just don't see how it would be possible for a DDK to look over pro games and learn much without learning the basics.

How can a baby learn to speak a language without learning the basics -- verbs, nouns, sentence structure?

They learn by imitating what they hear. Later, the classroom instruction of the basics will bring more clarity to what they've already learned to understand from practical usage.

Actually babies don't learn it on their own, they are partially taught by a parent (and others). You will notice that people instinctively repeat words, say them slowly... to babies. For your theory to work, you would need a lot of pro players all around you that will show you things from time to time. That is by the way, how most kids or pro players learn the game.

[Monadology]

Actually babies don't learn it on their own, they are partially taught by a parent (and others). You will notice that people instinctively repeat words, say them slowly... to babies. For your theory to work, you would need a lot of pro players all around you that will show you things from time to time. That is by the way, how most kids or pro players learn the game.

Linguistic development in infants is not definitively understood by the experts much less by any of us, so I'd be wary of extending this analogy too far (or using it in the first place).

[Dante31]

Actually babies don't learn it on their own, they are partially taught by a parent (and others). You will notice that people instinctively repeat words, say them slowly... to babies. For your theory to work, you would need a lot of pro players all around you that will show you things from time to time. That is by the way, how most kids or pro players learn the game.

Linguistic development in infants is not definitively understood by the experts much less by any of us, so I'd be wary of extending this analogy too far (or using it in the first place).

The exact process is not understood but some factors are known. The fact that they don't learn it 100% through just listening is for certain. I do agree that it was a bad analogy to start with. Personally I like my math one.

[kukula]

Hi Folks,

I am brand new to this forum & very much a beginner at Go. I first learned to play around 1980 but have never stuck with it for any long enough stretch to get any good. Now I am playing against the computer and on pandanet a bit so maybe I am getting better.

I have been studying Shotwell's Go! More Than a Game a bit. I see something that seems to be a fundamental error. This must be my own confusion somehow, would be my guess! I hope someone here can straighten me out.

He shows a seki example on pg 74. After W2, surely white has two good eyes and is immortal??? I don't see how black can threaten!

Help!

Thanks,
Jim

[kukula]

I have been studying Shotwell's Go! More Than a Game a bit.
[...]
He shows a seki example on pg 74. After W2, surely white has two good eyes and is immortal??? I don't see how black can threaten!

Here is a picture (if I can get the tags right!)



How can black attack white here or get any kind of seki?

Thanks!

[Harleqin]

Black cannot do anything, but White cannot either. So, both sides' stones are alive: the white group, and the black group that consists of two stones in the corner (the outside black stones are assumed to live anyway, even though the cuts there should be protected in order not to distract from the problem at hand).

[Li Kao]

If white plays B18 trying to kill blacks two stones it is self atari. B can't kill white either. So we have a seki.
Technically w could cut at C14 and then kill some black stones and live without seki. But as Harleqin said that's probably outside of the problem.

[kukula]

Wow, thanks for the help! But I still don't understand!

Why isn't A16 a second eye for the white group, so that white can live no matter what happens in the corner?

I didn't realize just how much of a beginner I am!

Thanks!

[Li Kao]

A16 is an eye. But B18 is no eye, just a shared liberty between the black and white stones.
White can't capture the two black stones in the corner. But can't be captures either. Because playing on the shared liberty at B18 would be suicide for both sides.