Staggering US and European congresses

[Joaz Banbeck]

The EGC is always held in two weeks that contain July 31 and August 1.

I don't think the date will have any major impact on Korean attendance...

I would expect that competing against the US Go Congress would split the Korean pros. I'm not sure who loses more, whether the US loses more Asian pros to Europe or vice versa, but we both lose. And the Asian pros miss out on an opportunity to play.

I've always though that it would be best if the EGF and the AGA cooperated to make a 'circuit' for Asian pros. We could have the congresses separated by about a week, which would give the pros time to do a little sightseeing, relax, fly to the other continent, and be ready to play in the next congress.

There is an additional travel benefit for the pros. Western Europe and Korea look like they are in almost opposite sides of the western hemisphere. If a Korean could stop in the US on his way there or on his way back, it would cost him almost nothing to do so. For some pros in eastern China, visiting the US is simlilarly on the oposite side of the globe, and stopping in Europe costs almost nothing.

[deja]

I've always though that it would be best if the EGF and the AGA cooperated to make a 'circuit' for Asian pros. We could have the congresses separated by about a week, which would give the pros time to do a little sightseeing, relax, fly to the other continent, and be ready to play in the next congress.

There is an additional travel benefit for the pros. Western Europe and Korea look like they are in almost opposite sides of the western hemisphere. If a Korean could stop in the US on his way there or on his way back, it would cost him almost nothing to do so. For some pros in eastern China, visiting the US is simlilarly on the oposite side of the globe, and stopping in Europe costs almost nothing.

Best idea I've heard yet...

[pwaldron]

I would expect that competing against the US Go Congress would split the Korean pros. I'm not sure who loses more, whether the US loses more Asian pros to Europe or vice versa, but we both lose. And the Asian pros miss out on an opportunity to play.

The only pros who play in the US Open are those who live in North America. Visiting pros don't play. They're welcome to, of course, but they don't. Coordinating dates isn't going to help much either; the AGA has reduced the number of invitations to foreign pros.

On the other hand, the US Congress might lose out on amateur visitors, but it doesn't seem like that many come to compete in the US Open.

[Joaz Banbeck]

I would expect that competing against the US Go Congress would split the Korean pros. I'm not sure who loses more, whether the US loses more Asian pros to Europe or vice versa, but we both lose. And the Asian pros miss out on an opportunity to play.

The only pros who play in the US Open are those who live in North America. Visiting pros don't play. They're welcome to, of course, but they don't. Coordinating dates isn't going to help much either; the AGA has reduced the number of invitations to foreign pros.

In this instance, an 'invitation' includes some type of perks, right?

[pwaldron]

In this instance, an 'invitation' includes some type of perks, right?

My understanding is invited pros have airfare, accommodations and meals paid for, plus a cash payment. The amount of cash may depend on whether the pros is North American/visiting, and the airfare of foreign pros may be picked up by their domestic organization (e.g., the Nihon Kiin). I've never been involved in the details, though, so don't take it as gospel.

I should go back and say that there are good reasons to coordinate between America and Europe. If nothing else, it would make it more reasonable for Westerners to attend both events.

[breakfast]

In this instance, an 'invitation' includes some type of perks, right?

My understanding is invited pros have airfare, accommodations and meals paid for, plus a cash payment. The amount of cash may depend on whether the pros is North American/visiting, and the airfare of foreign pros may be picked up by their domestic organization (e.g., the Nihon Kiin). I've never been involved in the details, though, so don't take it as gospel.

I should go back and say that there are good reasons to coordinate between America and Europe. If nothing else, it would make it more reasonable for Westerners to attend both events.

I am pretty sure that Nihon Kiin and Korean Baduk Association cover airplane fee

[hyperpape]

The only pros who play in the US Open are those who live in North America. Visiting pros don't play. They're welcome to, of course, but they don't.

I can think of exactly one exception in the time when I've been following the congress (4 years, I guess)--Ko Juyeon, Chinese 2p. It would definitely be interesting to see some foreign professionals playing in the Open.

In another weird phenomenon, I don't recall Feng Yun ever playing in the Open, while Myungwan doesn't play in the Ing Masters. We're really losing some interesting spectating with that pattern.

[kex]

There is an additional travel benefit for the pros. Western Europe and Korea look like they are in almost opposite sides of the western hemisphere. If a Korean could stop in the US on his way there or on his way back, it would cost him almost nothing to do so. For some pros in eastern China, visiting the US is simlilarly on the oposite side of the globe, and stopping in Europe costs almost nothing.

I am not sure your math works. Seoul - Helsinki flight is approx. 9 h 30 min (and back is 40 mins faster). From Helsinki, most larger European cities are a 2-3 hour flight away. If you look at the flight from Western Europe to Eastern U.S. it will be perhaps 7 hours, then 4 hours more to get to the western U.S. and probably around 10 hours from there to Korea. So my guesstimate is that the "around the globe" solution would be about 1.5 times flying compared to just popping up in Europe and flying then back the same way.

But on your actual point I do agree. Why to organize competing event at the same time?

[Joaz Banbeck]

As you can see, I split this thread off from the 'who qualifies as European' thread. If anyone objects, please PM me.

[kokomi]

As you can see, I split this thread off from the 'who qualifies as European' thread. If anyone objects, please PM me.

Guess we can reply now?

So funny Europeans keep on fighting on 'who qualifies as European'. Does Americans have the same problem? 'who qualifies as American'?

In terms of attracting Asian players...It's also funny that they are just fighting within themselves blindly without knowing what actually happens in Asia. Do they ever do any advertisement on any CJK domestic Go press/magazines/online servers? I guess not. They are trying to attract more Asian players while their target just simply don't know that they can come. I read some comments on Tom about the EGC " Wow, It's so good that so many Europeans are interested in playing Go. How I wish I could play there! What do I need to qualify to go?" Not all people speak english, many don't know what is EGC, most don't know they don't need to qualify anything to enter and where they can find any information...same time on forum endless discussion about why they have single-digit number less ex-insei than last year because last year's prize isn't satisfactory. (I mean those ex-inseis are really really really only a small part of go population in CJK countries)

[kokomi]

seems my comments are off-topic

all come from reading that 'who qualifies as European'

But still, the same, it's not necessary to stagger two congresses if you have more resources of players.

[willemien]

What is the best stagering?

if i interprete http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jetlag correctly

then East Asia - Europe - USA - East Asia is for most people better than

East Asia - USA - Europe - East Asia.

But also there should be 2 weeks between the two USA congresses (to overcome jetlag)

[HermanHiddema]

As you can see, I split this thread off from the 'who qualifies as European' thread. If anyone objects, please PM me.

Guess we can reply now?

So funny Europeans keep on fighting on 'who qualifies as European'. Does Americans have the same problem? 'who qualifies as American'?

Well, there was quite a bit of discussion some time ago on who is eligible to collect points for being the US representative to the WAGC, with the same basic question of whether it should require a passport, or whether long time residents (who might have a passport in the future) should also be eligible (for some definition of long, and for some likelihood of having a passport in the future, I guess).

But then, this is off topic for this thread, and even for the "Who qualifies as European" thread, so I guess someone will have to start a "Who qualifies as American/USA-ian" thread

[Kirby]

...

In terms of attracting Asian players...It's also funny that they are just fighting within themselves blindly without knowing what actually happens in Asia. Do they ever do any advertisement on any CJK domestic Go press/magazines/online servers? I guess not...

I subscribe to a Korean go magazine, and I have seen ads for both the European and US go congresses (although, one of the US congress ads had a picture of the statue of liberty, which would be tough to see from Colorado).

Periodically, I pick up the Japanese 碁ワールド, as well. I haven't noticed any congress ads, but I may have missed them.

In any case, at least some advertisement happens.

[hilltopgo]

What is the best stagering?

if i interprete http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jetlag correctly

then East Asia - Europe - USA - East Asia is for most people better than

East Asia - USA - Europe - East Asia.

But also there should be 2 weeks between the two USA congresses (to overcome jetlag)

That sounds like the European Congress ought to happen before the US Congress. Which puts the US Congress in August -- potential conflict with students returning to school (and their families). Most schools here start up again in early September, but it seems to me like an increasing number of them are starting up as early as the middle of August.

I don't think this necessarily rules out having the US Congress in August. I would like to see them staggered, though perhaps with only a week between the events.