It is currently Sat Jul 20, 2019 3:35 pm

All times are UTC - 8 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 212 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7 ... 11  Next
Author Message
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Ian Butler's Journal - New Planning Theory
Post #61 Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2018 1:04 pm 
Honinbo

Posts: 8592
Liked others: 2511
Was liked: 2962
BlindGroup wrote:
jlt wrote:
Maybe the L+1 group was not killable because of the P4 cut?


I played it out a little bit with Lizzie. If he had haned to play P1 at :b25:, I think it works, but it turns into a very complicated fight. Additionally, white is able to develop the cut into a center group that eliminates the value of black's influence. So, black would win the battle but lose the war as they say.


Good point. :)

BTW, Ian, was the hane at T-05 Lizzie's choice for :b27: ? The simple sagari at T-04 threatens to kill the corner (although White may ignore that for the moment) and avoids strengthening White on the right side.

_________________
There is one human race.
----------------------------------------------------

The Adkins Principle:

At some point, doesn't thinking have to go on?

— Winona Adkins

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Ian Butler's Journal - New Planning Theory
Post #62 Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2018 1:06 pm 
Lives in gote

Posts: 602
Liked others: 53
Was liked: 104
Life and Death
My L&D skills are visibly improving. Doing 15 minutes of L&D really pays off!
If only I'd learn to be more aggressive/less lenient towards groups I might make a big step forward. That is, I think, still one of my biggest weaknesses. I usually make life for my opponent too easy. I contend too easily in taking the outside and let my opponent live on the side/in the corner. That trade is okay, but I shouldn't make it too easy for my opponent neither. And if killing is an option, it should be considered.

Doing L&D in 1001 L&D problems is a lot of fun. I do it 15 minutes every day in my class room (I do this thing where we all read for 15 minutes a day. the kids read a book, I do L&D). Calms me down, makes me focus and, like I said, really improves my reading.

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Ian Butler's Journal - New Planning Theory
Post #63 Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2018 1:08 pm 
Lives in gote

Posts: 602
Liked others: 53
Was liked: 104
Bill Spight wrote:
BlindGroup wrote:
jlt wrote:
Maybe the L+1 group was not killable because of the P4 cut?


I played it out a little bit with Lizzie. If he had haned to play P1 at :b25:, I think it works, but it turns into a very complicated fight. Additionally, white is able to develop the cut into a center group that eliminates the value of black's influence. So, black would win the battle but lose the war as they say.


Good point. :)

BTW, Ian, was the hane at T-05 Lizzie's choice for :b27: ? The simple sagari at T-04 threatens to kill the corner (although White may ignore that for the moment) and avoids strengthening White on the right side.


Actually Leela (I use Leela .11, not Lizzie) also said T-04. But in my review I used T-05 because I understood that move more than the T-04. I think I understand it better now :)

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Ian Butler's Journal - New Planning Theory
Post #64 Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2018 1:44 pm 
Honinbo

Posts: 8592
Liked others: 2511
Was liked: 2962
Ian Butler wrote:
Bill Spight wrote:
BTW, Ian, was the hane at T-05 Lizzie's choice for :b27: ? The simple sagari at T-04 threatens to kill the corner (although White may ignore that for the moment) and avoids strengthening White on the right side.


Actually Leela (I use Leela .11, not Lizzie) also said T-04. But in my review I used T-05 because I understood that move more than the T-04. I think I understand it better now :)


One important advantage of reviewing with Leela is that it can show you moves that you did not even think about. :D That's valuable even without explanation or variations.

In this case you projected Black T-05 - White T-06, Black T-04. At this point I hope that it is now fairly clear that Black T-04 is better in this case. An example of Charles Matthews' "1-2-3 principle". (Or is it his "A-B-C principle"? I forget.) Anyway, if you see a three move sequence, check to see if simply playing the third move is better. :)

_________________
There is one human race.
----------------------------------------------------

The Adkins Principle:

At some point, doesn't thinking have to go on?

— Winona Adkins

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Ian Butler's Journal - New Planning Theory
Post #65 Posted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 3:41 pm 
Lives in gote

Posts: 387
Liked others: 295
Was liked: 59
IGS: 4k
Universal go server handle: BlindGroup
Ian Butler wrote:
I have an old print of the Cho Chikun book 'All About Life and Death', but I'd definitely appreciate the SGF files you have!


Sent via PM.

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Ian Butler's Journal - New Planning Theory
Post #66 Posted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 3:19 am 
Lives in gote

Posts: 602
Liked others: 53
Was liked: 104
BlindGroup wrote:
Ian Butler wrote:
I have an old print of the Cho Chikun book 'All About Life and Death', but I'd definitely appreciate the SGF files you have!


Sent via PM.


Much appreciated!

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Ian Butler's Journal - New Planning Theory
Post #67 Posted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 3:34 am 
Lives in gote

Posts: 602
Liked others: 53
Was liked: 104
Quote:
There is no teacher but the enemy. No one but the enemy is going to tell you what the enemy is going to do. No one but the enemy will ever teach you how to destroy and conquer. Only the enemy shows you where you are weak. Only the enemy tells you where he is strong. [...] I am your enemy from now on. From now on I am your teacher.

-- excerpt from Ender's Game


While this quote goes about war, it made me think instantly of Go. Just change the words 'enemy' to 'opponent' and 'destroy and conquer' to ... 'destroy and conquer' :lol:


This post by Ian Butler was liked by 2 people: BlindGroup, Elom
Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Ian Butler's Journal - Teacher, teach me
Post #68 Posted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:13 am 
Lives in gote

Posts: 602
Liked others: 53
Was liked: 104
New Books!
Ordered a few new books to dive further into the world of Go.
Most books are less about improving to play myself (they do that, but not very effectively), rather to expand on my Go-lore.

A few books from the 'Master Play, The Style of ...' series:
- Go Seigen
- Takemiya
- Lee Sedol
- Kato Masao & Seo Bong Soo

By John Fairbairn:
- Go Consultants
- Go Companion

Also:
- Attacking and Defending weak groups (newest book in Mastertering the basics of Go series)
- How to play Handicap Go

And an entire tsumego series called:
You won't get dumber thinking. Pocket books tsumego, 8 volumes, ranging from 20 kyu to 3 kyu.

I also ordered my first set of Chinese stones (flat on one side) for analysing purposes and because they are cool :cool:
And lastly the Nihon Ki-in 2019 calendar, in which I'll be marking my 2019 Go studies.

2019: Under Construction
So for 2019 I'm going to try a new study theory. I've already talked about it above but I'm trying to make it more concrete. Hopefully I can kick it off starting 1st of January, 2019.

For now, it looks like I'll use a calendar to mark my activities, always for the week to come (no further in the future). Although I'll mark some things earlier in advance, probably.
I'll cross, or mark, the things I did. If I don't manage to do something (because something came between it, or I didn't feel like doing Go that day), it doesn't move up the calender. Instead it's just passed over. Like that. (there are exceptions)

I'll probably also use different categories to make sure the studies are diverse enough to keep interest. In these categories I'll also have different types of study, which I'll try to switch up.
Example: if I have the following 4 sub-categories in Pro Games Study (see below), I might schedule Pro Games Study in once a week, let's say on Thursday. Then I'll probably do: 1st thursday of the month: Shape! 2nd thursday: Counting! and so on.
I can mark these activities far in advance.

Categories I've come up already, but will think on deeper later:

Pro Games Study
1. Shape! = replay quickly, only look at shape or a specific theme.
2. Counting! = replay quickly, analyse board + counting every x moves
3. Next move? = replay but every few moves, come up with 3 possible next moves.
4. Pro Study! = replay with commentary, think about every move, etc.

Book Learning
Only 1 or 2 books at the time. Books like: Attack & Defense.
These activities best marked only a week in advance, progress in books may vary.

Tesuji/L&D Books
Exceptions on the "pass over" rule. If I miss the next lesson in Jump Level Up, or don't do Chapter 5 of Tesuji, I won't pass it over, but do it again. These tasks are to be written down max. 1 week in advance, to make sure I don't make a chore out of it.
- Jump Level Up
- Tesuji

Game Reviews
Review games. These can be:
- games played
- online games by other players

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Ian Butler's Journal - Teacher, teach me
Post #69 Posted: Thu Dec 13, 2018 9:36 am 
Lives in gote

Posts: 602
Liked others: 53
Was liked: 104
Leela .11 finally rated me 1 Dan for the first time. Obviously the Leela .11 ranks are not very close to the online server ranks or the European, American, Chinese... ranks, but it's still a good sign.
Of course, it still amazes me every time how white can get so in the game with such a big handicap. And when I try that myself, I end up getting killed big time.

L&D, it always comes down to that.

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Ian Butler's Journal - Teacher, teach me
Post #70 Posted: Sat Dec 15, 2018 1:14 pm 
Lives in gote

Posts: 602
Liked others: 53
Was liked: 104
I now officially hate Leela.
I really hate her.

I beat her once with 6 handicap stones. Then she beat me 10 times in a row, bringing me back to 7 stones.
I truly hate her.

Though to be honest I'll probably stop playing her for a while now. While it's "interesting" to have an opponent who punishes every single mistake, it's not really fun anymore. Any keima that can be cut is cut. Every single throw-in that works, she gets right immediately. Every group that CAN die, will die. Every group I might kill, she finds a way to live. Every connection not truly there, she breaks. I can never kill anything of her, she always finds the perfect play to kill my group, disrupt my moyo or whatever.
There's just no winning with her. So off she goes for now :p

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Ian Butler's Journal - Teacher, teach me
Post #71 Posted: Sun Dec 16, 2018 3:08 am 
Lives in gote

Posts: 602
Liked others: 53
Was liked: 104
Well, I just played a very interesting Blitz game. It was against a 3 kyu on OGS, where I am around 8-9 kyu.
5 minutes main time and 3x15s Byo-Yomi.

I played a very well game up to a point. Analysing with Leela also showed that, even more than I thought during the game. I was ahead most of the time and got quite a lead, even. I managed to take a huge middle and I was like +20 points ahead.
But then, because it was blitz and I was already in the stressfull Byo-Yomi, I totally missed his connection back up to his stones (I was thinking it was a slower endgame move) around move 141, and then my lead slowly evaperated in the endgame.

So all in all a game I can be happy with: I went toe to toe with a 3 kyu and nearly survived, I even did well for a while.

So 141 definitely the losing move. If I cut the connection there, I think I win. Though much of the endgame is against me, that middle is pretty nice.


Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Ian Butler's Journal - Blitzing!
Post #72 Posted: Tue Dec 18, 2018 12:44 pm 
Lives in gote

Posts: 602
Liked others: 53
Was liked: 104
Quote:
A wise man is not someone who makes no mistakes. A wise man is one who learns from his mistakes when he sees them.


I'm starting to believe there are many ways to Go and that "efficiency" is only a valid term for people who want to make pro.
For example the entire debate about replaying Pro games. Is it good? Some say playing it slowly is useless, you cannot understand it anyway, so you have to play it fast. Others say it's good.

I'm replaying a lot of pro/strong dan games lately and - while it's probably far from the most efficient way to get stronger - I know it's helping my Go. While I'm doing it, I don't even care about my Go. I'm too enveloped in the game before me. Even if it wouldn't help my Go, I'd still do it.

So like many wise men have said before: do what you want to do.
If you're doing things that are Go-related, chances are you'll improve. Or not. And who cares? ;-)


This post by Ian Butler was liked by 2 people: ez4u, seberle
Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Ian Butler's Journal - Blitzing!
Post #73 Posted: Wed Dec 19, 2018 4:14 am 
Lives in gote
User avatar

Posts: 469
Liked others: 41
Was liked: 160
Ian Butler wrote:
For example the entire debate about replaying Pro games. Is it good? Some say playing it slowly is useless, you cannot understand it anyway, so you have to play it fast. Others say it's good.


I don't know which way is better, but I think that no one completely "understands" a game. At my kyu level I can understand at least one purpose of each move of a pro game, even be impressed by some clever moves, but there are several other moves I would have considered, and I often don't know if/why they are less good. I can also read some variations, but may miss some important variations or consider useless ones. Better players eliminate more bad moves, select more good moves, and read more relevant variations, but no one can claim to know which move is the best, except in rare circumstances.

By the way, I would be curious to know if strong bots agree with what Shuko considers to be the only move.

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Ian Butler's Journal - Blitzing!
Post #74 Posted: Wed Dec 19, 2018 5:32 am 
Judan

Posts: 5939
Location: Cambridge, UK
Liked others: 338
Was liked: 3183
Rank: UK 4 dan
KGS: Uberdude 4d
OGS: Uberdude 7d
jlt wrote:
By the way, I would be curious to know if strong bots agree with what Shuko considers to be the only move.

viewtopic.php?p=235972#p235972
viewtopic.php?p=235976#p235976
viewtopic.php?p=236013#p236013

Summary, usually Elf agreed with Shuko when he said the move played in the real game was bad, said his alternative was better (but not always best) for a respectable proportion of problems, but his example continuations quite often overlooked what Elf thought were the best moves, particularly for his opponent (indulgent reading).


This post by Uberdude was liked by: jlt
Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Ian Butler's Journal - Blitzing!
Post #75 Posted: Wed Dec 19, 2018 11:00 am 
Lives in gote

Posts: 602
Liked others: 53
Was liked: 104
I had never before heard of this 'the only move'. They look like 2 books on whole board problems, correct?


Late Middle-game
Concerning strength, I think I play a relatively stable opening and endgame, where I slowly improve to make it better.
My middle-game, however, is prone to much more spread. I'm starting to notice something, that might be true or might just be a coincidence:

The late middle game is where magic happens, or not.
My openings are okay-ish, I'd think. I don't fall behind a lot, don't get ahead too much, just normal. The game gets started and both players start staking out territory or moyo's. All is normal.
But when we hit the point of the late middle-game (like 2nd half of it), meaning where area is really starting to take shape, but before endgame, so when it's not too late just yet, then my game changes depending on the situation.

When I am behind at this point, I sometimes play some of my best Go, trying to get back in the game. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. When I play passively, it probably means I didn't count and am not aware I need something to get back in the game. when I know it, I usually show great fighting spirit, sometimes with results.

But when I am ahead, I play my worst game. I greatly feel that this is my worst aspect at Go at the moment. When I feel/am ahead, I lose some overview of what is still big and I start playing real slow moves. I also get attached to area (that's already mostly decided) and am contend to just close it off. I lose any sharpness and allow too much. Against a stronger opponent, it's usually because I'm afraid to still lose. Against a weaker opponent, it's because I feel I'll win anyway. Either way, it's a mistake and good that I'm aware of it.
So late middle-game, dangerous time for me. Don't lose sharpness, don't lose focus. Keep the eye on big moves! Don't be afraid. Don't be lazy. Don't be arrogant.

Good lessons to learn. Easy to understand. Harder to put into practice :)

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Ian Butler's Journal - the late middle-game
Post #76 Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2018 5:46 am 
Lives in gote

Posts: 602
Liked others: 53
Was liked: 104
So I have 2 weeks off from work. I want to take that time to relax a bit, enjoy myself. But I also want to use part of my time to study some more Go.

Today is such a day of study. Waking up at 7 am, I already:
- Played a 19x19 game against Crazy Stone
- finished Jump Level Up 3 and can now move on to JLU 4!
- Read almost half of Cho Hunyun's Opening Lectures
- Replayed a game from Yuan Zhou's book (understanding how to play Go - with commentary)
- Played (and lost heavily) against a 4kyu OGS.
- Analysed the game and posted a threat in the Study Group about a particular opening I want to know more about.

To fill up the gaps (study breaks), I've been learning a piano song from Hikaru No Go. I'm over halfway the song!

And now it's almost 2 pm. I won't keep studying Go for the rest of the day, that'd be slight overkill. Though what I still want to do today is:
- Catch up on some 4-5 joseki (after that game, I have to)
- Do some L&D (after that game, I have to)

Maybe that's enough for one day and I'll relax a bit, read a book, play some more piano. Sounds good.

In the coming weeks, though, I plan to start a re-read of both Attack & Defense, but also Tesuji (Davies) and perhaps also Get Strong at Tesuji.

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Ian Butler's Journal - the late middle-game
Post #77 Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2018 7:30 am 
Lives in gote

Posts: 602
Liked others: 53
Was liked: 104
From 2018 to 2019!

Part 1: finances and effort
Besides about a month in 2017, I really started playing go in early February 2018, if I remember correctly. With 2018 ending, I thought it'd be nice to make some sort of balance after about a year of playing, and also look forward to the next year, filled with Go.
First part is mostly on finances and effort. Why? Because Go has been my biggest investement of the year (besides rent, it's been the thing I spent the most money on).

To start off. This is what I purchased this year (with my final order placed today):

- Over 50 Go books. Honestly, over 50! (well, including Jump Level Up 1, JLU 2, JLU 3...)
- A goban of €1500, several go boards for table use, about 10 boards of 9x9 and 13x13 for the Go club, shell stones of about €300, many sets of glass stones, 2 magnetic boards (1 small, 1 medium), a 9x9 mini Goban with legs, a 13x13 mini Goban with legs.

All in all I reckon I've spent just about €2500-3000 on Go this year, if not more. I don't regret it, because it is beautiful, usefull or interesting to me. However, I've decided to drastically cut my financial investment in Go. Mostly because I have plenty of stuff already, I won't need another board or book in a long time, I think. Maybe another book or so every once in a while, but probably rarily.

As for time commitment, I've started 2018 with an obsessive attitude towards Go. I had to take a break of several months to recover from it. I'm ending 2018 with another high-period of Go. Hobbies like that usually come in waves. I've been high on the wave, been very low but I haven't stopped and I'm back on a higher part of the wave.
Still, I'll be mindful not to step into obsession again, and to take plenty of periods where I take some more distance from the game.


Part 2 will probably be about how I'll be spending my time in 2019! Or at least, how I see it now.
Part 3 will then probably feature some of my hopes, dreams, "fears" and whatnot about what 2019 will bring, Go-related.

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Ian Butler's Journal - 2018 reflections, 2019 ambitions
Post #78 Posted: Thu Dec 27, 2018 10:38 am 
Lives in gote

Posts: 602
Liked others: 53
Was liked: 104
Part 2 of my take on 2019 will be here soon. In between: this.

Today I went through 6 pro games in the Kiseido (mastering the basics series) book: attacking and defending moyo's.
So a marathon pro game study, with lots of great games.

I wanted to play one myself, too, of course, and funnily enough it turned into some sort of moyo game.
I got 2 stones handicap against an OGS 6-7 kyu, and he messed up a L&D on the bottom. I was heavily ahead, and so white had no choice but to bank everything on a big middle.

I didn't panic (like I used to do), but instead kept taking large points, first, and then finally decrease the moyo from each side. It worked out wonderful. Also the L&D on the bottom was good for me, I've been working hard on it lately and killing this group shows I've made improvement.

2 negatives from this game, to learn from are:
1) still some very slow, almost dame moves nearing the endgame.
2) a captured group came back to life after I had been "tricked" into taking 3 stones. This was careless of me.

2 positives from this game for me:
1) I played unafraid. Looking for sente, forcing, cutting. But also not attacking before getting strong myself first.
2) L&D put into practice, reading during the game and killing a group. Big for me.



I think, though, that 2 stones were not correct. Blindgroup told me that he finds the rankings on OGS to be something strange and I agree. I think I am not at the right level at my current rank and perhaps I am 7 kyu myself. Maybe playing more games will help that ranking? Either way, I won't take 2 stones from a 7 kyu again.

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Ian Butler's Journal - 2018 reflections, 2019 ambitions
Post #79 Posted: Fri Dec 28, 2018 5:16 am 
Lives in gote

Posts: 602
Liked others: 53
Was liked: 104
As an experiment, I have played 10 OGS games in about 3,5 hours.

Win 7 kyu
Lost 7 kyu
Lost 12 kyu
Win 10 kyu
Win 14 kyu
Lost 4 kyu
Lost 4 kyu
Lost 11 kyu
Lost 5 kyu
Win 9 kyu

After the experiment, I can honestly say I am disgusted. So the experiment was a success in one way: I know this is something to never (never?) repeat. Playing online has always made me a bit nervous and afraid. And I guess playing 10 games in a row kind of helps with that, because now an individuel game matters less.

But it's not my style, definitely, definitely not. Right now I feel like I am a lousy player and I should quit go. I know this is just because of what happened and these emotions go away, I can identify them and see them rationally, but I also know why the feelings are there and I don't think it's in any way positive for me to go through this by choice. So 10 games online in a row, no thanks.

But it's also making me reconsider my 2019 efforts, or just my general future of go. To make real progress, you have to invest quite some time. If you only invest a little time, I think you kind of stand still. So I'll have to decide for myself if I want to put in all that time. If the result (Go) is worth it. No easy questions :)


Anyway, that's enough Go for one day. Really. Really, really really! :lol:


This post by Ian Butler was liked by: yakcyll
Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Ian Butler's Journal - 2018 reflections, 2019 ambitions
Post #80 Posted: Fri Dec 28, 2018 6:29 am 
Lives in gote
User avatar

Posts: 469
Liked others: 41
Was liked: 160
Only 10 games? ;-) I sometimes play 25 games in a single day, from early morning until late evening, but then almost stop playing online for several months. That's probably not the best way to make progress.

Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 212 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7 ... 11  Next

All times are UTC - 8 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group