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 Post subject: Re: The Reign of Ke Jie
Post #301 Posted: Fri Sep 28, 2018 7:45 am 
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What about the alphago joseki in the lower right? https://lifein19x19.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=16104

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 Post subject: Re: The Reign of Ke Jie
Post #302 Posted: Wed Dec 05, 2018 4:22 am 
Judan

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Ke Jie just won the 23rd Samsung cup, his 6th international title. So whilst his rating on goratings.com might not be top anymore, he's still doing a better job that those above him (Shin Jinseo, Mi Yuting, Park did win Bailing earlier this year) at winning the big events.


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 Post subject: Re: The Reign of Ke Jie
Post #303 Posted: Thu Dec 13, 2018 8:56 am 
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After his win yesterday against Chen Yaoye in the Chinese A-league and Mi Yuting's loss to Park Junghwan, Ke Jie is now #1 in China again (according to GoRatings)!

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 Post subject: Re: The Reign of Ke Jie
Post #304 Posted: Thu Jan 17, 2019 10:19 pm 
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As reported by macelee elswhere on this forum, Ke Jie has just won the 4th edition of the Bailing Cup, beating South Korea's Shin Jinseo by a score of 2-0 in the finals. This is Ke Jie's 7th international title.

Also noted by macelee, Ke Jie has been winning international titles at a faster clip than the great Lee Changho:
macelee wrote:
Ke Jie 's 7th international title (21 years 168 days old), beating Lee Changho's record (22 years 288 days).

IMHO, topping rankings is nice, but bringing home the hardware by beating stiff international competition is better. The wunderkind's reign continues...

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 Post subject: Re: The Reign of Ke Jie
Post #305 Posted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 4:33 am 
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Quote:
Ke Jie has been winning international titles at a faster clip than the great Lee Changho:


It's obviously a matter of personal taste, but I've always disliked the use of dubious statistics in sport to show in apples & pears fashion which player of different eras was allegedly the best. This instance seems especially egregious.

I haven't checked properly but it would seem that Yi Ch'ang-ho's international title tally of 7 in the time-frame given here must include the 1st World's Strongest. If that is the case you'd have to include the TV Asia Championship, in which case Yi Ch'ang-ho was surely faster to 7.

If you exclude both (on the grounds they were not truly open), then Ke Jie's progression could seem even more impressive.

However, for me, the crunch statistic not mentioned is that there were 11 international tournaments available for Ke Jie to play in, but only 4 for Yi Ch'ang-ho in the time-frame being used (or 6 if you count the WS and TV Asia, but then he'd be the first to 7 changes).

Since I dislike these comparisons I am not arguing that Yi is better than Ke or vice versa. I am simply arguing for a more guarded use of statistics, especially where there is a risk that nationalistic overtones could be drawn in.

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 Post subject: Re: The Reign of Ke Jie
Post #306 Posted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 5:30 am 
Judan

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Were there really that fewer opportunities for Lee to win international titles than Ke as an 11 vs 4 comparison suggests? (The principle is important though, making Sakata's title haul in Japan when there were fewer titles all the more impressive) Quite a few of the titles these days are new and have only had 1 edition so far (Xinao, Tianfu) or are biennal (MLily, Bailing, Chunlan). Probably a fairer comparison would be along the lines of in the period from [age 16? / when they won their first title / something else] to age 22 there were X international events of which player won Y. https://senseis.xmp.net/?InternationalTitleStatistics would be useful.

Since start of 2015 (when Ke won his first title) to now (4 years) there are 22 events on that list (from 9 tournaments, what are John's 2 extra?), Ke won 7 or 32%. Since start of 1992 (when Lee won his first, a bit younger than Ke) to end 1995 (4 years) there were 13 events of which Lee won 3 (23%). However, to end of 1997 (thus we include Samsung and LG events which just started) so we end with Lee aged 22 like Ke almost is now there were 23 events of which Lee won 8 (35%). Pretty similar.

And for comparison Lee Sedol was a little older at 19 when he won his first international in Aug 2002. In the next 4 years there were 23 events and he won 6 (26%). Adding on the next 2 years to give him a 6 year period from his first title there were 35 events and he won 11 (31%).


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 Post subject: Re: The Reign of Ke Jie
Post #307 Posted: Thu Jan 31, 2019 9:32 am 
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Ke Jie just beat Park Junghwan in the opening game of the annual Chinese CCTV Cup, and it's one of the rare time between the two where black won. Ke looked to be trailing after the left side exchange, but Park played really conservatively after mid-game (move 150, 152, and 154 were especially criticized for having no value) and ended up losing by 1.5 points. He will still have a chance for revenge if he could beat Shibano Toramaru tomorrow.


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 Post subject: Re: The Reign of Ke Jie
Post #308 Posted: Thu Jan 31, 2019 10:20 am 
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xiayun wrote:
Ke Jie just beat Park Junghwan in the opening game of the annual Chinese CCTV Cup, and it's one of the rare time between the two where black won. Ke looked to be trailing after the left side exchange, but Park played really conservatively after mid-game (move 150, 152, and 154 were especially criticized for having no value) and ended up losing by 1.5 points. He will still have a chance for revenge if he could beat Shibano Toramaru tomorrow.


Does that mean the CCTV cup is an open tournament now (Chinese tournaments being international by default might be the future...)?

_________________
On Go proverbs:
"A fine Gotation is a diamond in the hand of a dan of wit and a pebble in the hand of a kyu" —Joseph Raux misquoted.

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 Post subject: Re: The Reign of Ke Jie
Post #309 Posted: Thu Jan 31, 2019 10:49 am 
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Elom wrote:
Does that mean the CCTV cup is an open tournament now (Chinese tournaments being international by default might be the future...)?


This is the special event held by CCTV (the Chinese national broadcaster) to celebrate the Chinese New Year, now in the 7th year. CCTV cup should be reserved to refer to the Chinese domestic tournament, whose winner and runner-up move on to play in the Asian TV Cup.

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 Post subject: Re: The Reign of Ke Jie
Post #310 Posted: Thu Jan 31, 2019 11:40 am 
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Sorry for the mixup. Yeah, this is the exhibition tournament with just 3 players that CCTV hosts for lunar new year.

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 Post subject: Re: The Reign of Ke Jie
Post #311 Posted: Fri Feb 01, 2019 9:46 am 
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Will indeed get the rematch with Park tomorrow.

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 Post subject: Re: The Reign of Ke Jie
Post #312 Posted: Sat Feb 02, 2019 3:05 am 
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xiayun wrote:
Ke Jie just beat Park Junghwan in the opening game of the annual Chinese CCTV Cup, and it's one of the rare time between the two where black won. Ke looked to be trailing after the left side exchange, but Park played really conservatively after mid-game (move 150, 152, and 154 were especially criticized for having no value) and ended up losing by 1.5 points. He will still have a chance for revenge if he could beat Shibano Toramaru tomorrow.


Park Junghwan just beat Ke Jie in the final game, with Black this time. There was a large fight that spread to nearly half of the board. The story seemed to be similar to their previous game, in that Park had an advantage after capturing two stones and taking away the eyes of the bottom group. He then made some conservative moves, particulary move 103. The fighting continued and Ke regained the advantage. Ke was poised to win, but unfortunately went crazy at the end(at least according to the Chinese commentators). Ke had three stones that were reducing Black's territory; however, instead of connecting them to his group, he instead played an atari on move 226, and the three stones simply died after White cut them.
An unfortunate way to lose the game.

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 Post subject: Re: The Reign of Ke Jie
Post #313 Posted: Sat Feb 02, 2019 8:20 am 
Judan

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Ke Jie's reaction:

https://streamable.com/ghq93


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 Post subject: Re: The Reign of Ke Jie
Post #314 Posted: Sat Feb 02, 2019 11:54 am 
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Uberdude wrote:


Classic Ke Jie reaction.

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 Post subject: Re: The Reign of Ke Jie
Post #315 Posted: Sat Feb 02, 2019 1:18 pm 
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Uberdude wrote:


Ha-ha, tell us how you really feel, Ke Jie, no need to suppress those emotions :-)

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 Post subject: Re: The Reign of Ke Jie
Post #316 Posted: Sat Feb 02, 2019 4:28 pm 
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The full broadcast from CCTV: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1WV6ZAxM0Y8. The ending mistake happened at 1:44:25, and in this one you could clearly hear Ke Jie saying the Chinese equivalent of f-word.

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 Post subject: Re: The Reign of Ke Jie
Post #317 Posted: Sat Feb 02, 2019 11:37 pm 
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xiayun wrote:
The full broadcast from CCTV: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1WV6ZAxM0Y8. The ending mistake happened at 1:44:25, and in this one you could clearly hear Ke Jie saying the Chinese equivalent of f-word.

Ke Jie now knows how Master Fujisawa felt on a few too many ocassions. :D

Althought it's not as bad as the blunder committed by Nakano Yasuhiro.

Re-live the moment:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qt1FvPxmmfE

:lol:

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 Post subject: Re: The Reign of Ke Jie
Post #318 Posted: Sun Feb 03, 2019 1:46 am 
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Ke Jie apologized on Weibo after for losing his cool, but everyone pretty much understood how he felt, not to mention it costed him ~$60K. Gu Li called it the biggest blunder of year (if we use Lunar calendar, this was basically the last game of the year), and based on his ranking, one could make the argument that this is the most unlikeliest blunder ever.

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 Post subject: Re: The Reign of Ke Jie
Post #319 Posted: Sun Feb 03, 2019 6:50 am 
Judan

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Ke Jie also made a bad blunder against Zhang Tao in Cctv cup a couple of years ago.

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 Post subject: Re: The Reign of Ke Jie
Post #320 Posted: Fri Mar 08, 2019 9:15 pm 
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A new domestic tournament, Champion of Champions, is being played right now. 8 players, double elimination.

Round 1:
Ke Jie vs. Mi Yuting
Gu Zihao vs. Lian Xiao
Fan Tingyu vs. Chen Yaoye
Xie Erhao vs. Tan Xiao

It just happened that the initial draw pitted the top 4 ranked Chinese players against each other.

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