jlt - Ian Butler Jubango (Game #8)

Bill Spight · Post by **Bill Spight** » Tue Feb 26, 2019 10:51 pm

Here's another wrinkle. :cool:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Bc White gives up three stones $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | X X X X X O X . . . . . . . X . X X X | $$ | O X O O O O X . . , . . . . . , X O O | $$ | W O 1 4 . O O X X . . . . . . X O . O | $$ | 5 3 2 O X O X O O X X X . . . X O O . | $$ | . 6 . O O X X O O O O X . . X O . . . | $$ | . . X O X O X O . . O X X . X O . . . | $$ | . . O X X . X O X O O O X X O O . . . | $$ | . . O O X . X X O , O X X O X , X . . | $$ | . . O X X X O X O O O . X O O O . . . | $$ | . . O X O O O O X X O X X X X O O . . | $$ | . O X X X X O X X . X X O O O . . O O | $$ | . O X . X O O . X . X X X O . . . O X | $$ | . . O X X X O O O X X . O O . O O X X | $$ | . . O O X X O . X , X . O X O O X X . | $$ | . . . O O O O X X . X X O X X X X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . O O X O O X X . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . O O X X . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

@ 1,

takes back, :b9:

@

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Wcm10 Oops! $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | X X X X X O X . . . . . . . X . X X X | $$ | 4 X O O O O X . . , . . . . . , X O O | $$ | X O 1 O . O O X X . . . . . . X O . O | $$ | X X O O X O X O O X X X . . . X O O . | $$ | 3 O . O O X X O O O O X . . X O . . . | $$ | 6 2 B O X O X O . . O X X . X O . . . | $$ | . 5 O X X . X O X O O O X X O O . . . | $$ | . . O O X . X X O , O X X O X , X . . | $$ | . . O X X X O X O O O . X O O O . . . | $$ | . . O X O O O O X X O X X X X O O . . | $$ | . O X X X X O X X . X X O O O . . O O | $$ | . O X . X O O . X . X X X O . . . O X | $$ | . . O X X X O O O X X . O O . O O X X | $$ | . . O O X X O . X , X . O X O O X X . | $$ | . . . O O O O X X . X X O X X X X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . O O X O O X X . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . O O X X . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

If

fills the ko, :b11:

takes it all. :shock:

Ian Butler · Post by **Ian Butler** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 1:23 am

We're at the halfway point of the Jubango now. The score is 4-1.

The next game has been postponed for a few weeks, I asked for this break. The reason is that I am unable to focus on Go at the moment, with some personal things going on. I want to complete the Jubango with the right concentration, and I couldn't focus on the game right now.

So expect the next match within a few weeks!

Ian Butler · Post by **Ian Butler** » Fri Nov 08, 2019 11:02 am

Tomorrow jlt and I will resume out Jubango. Score at 4-1.
I've been away from Go for quite a while, so it's guesswork how it'll go.

We decided to try and start with a 2H game, and see how our relative strength lie. Point of this jubango is to enjoy and to both be challenged, so I'm sure we'll agree on what handicap is in order at any time.

Looking forward to the game, a lot! We'll post it here afterwards, of course, hoping for some more of your wonderful feedback

Ian Butler · Post by **Ian Butler** » Sat Nov 09, 2019 4:40 am

And so the Jubango has continued! We played earlier today, this time a 2H game.
We reviewed it for ourselves a bit, too, but of course we're hoping to get input from stronger players so we can learn!
For me, it felt like a close game all throughout. My biggest mistake, I think, was gote-sente. Played too many (even small) gote moves, giving up the initiative. As a result, many of the moves I was eyeing were being taken by jlt.
But the 2 stones were just enough in the end to give me a (hard fought for) victory.

Appreciate any feedback! Our review is also in this .sgf, so you can follow our way of thinking and point out where we are dead wrong

It's 4-2 now, and we'll have to see what handicap is appropriate for next time. 2H felt close, so I guess that's good. Maybe back to reverse komi with me as black is in order? Not sure.

jlt · Post by **jlt** » Sat Nov 09, 2019 11:13 am

It was an interesting game. I reviewed it a bit with LeelaZero, which pointed out a few big mistakes by White.

At move 43, White should have played this way:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$W $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . | $$ | . . . X . . . . X . . . . . . X O X . | $$ | . . X , . X . . . , . . . . . X O X . | $$ | . . O O . . . . . . . . . . . X X O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . O | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . 8 . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6 . . | $$ | . . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . X 5 . | $$ | . O . X . . . . . . . . . . . . 7 3 . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . , . . . . O O O 2 . | $$ | . O X . . X . . . . . . O O X X X 4 . | $$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . 1 X . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Then Black lives in gote and the side group has no base. Moreover, White has a strong ponnuki:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Wm9 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . | $$ | . . . X . . . . X . . . . . . X O X . | $$ | . . X , . X . . . , . . . . . X O X . | $$ | . . O O . . . . . . . . . . . X X O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . O | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . | $$ | . O . X . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . , . . . . O O O X . | $$ | . O X . . X . . . . . . O O X X X X . | $$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . O X 1 2 . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 . . . 4 . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

At move 78 I was afraid that the marked stones would come out, and launch a splitting attack, so after several minutes of hesitation I chickened out and played "a":

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$ Position at move 78 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O X . | $$ | . . . X . . . . X . . . . . . X O X . | $$ | . . X , . X . . . , . . . . . X O X . | $$ | . . O O . . . . . . . . . . O X X O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . O | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X X X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . O X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . O X . . | $$ | . . O O . . . . . . . a B B O O X . . | $$ | . O . X . . . . . . . . . O X X X X X | $$ | . . O X . . . . . , . . . O O O O O O | $$ | . O X . . X . . . . . O O O X X X X O | $$ | . . . X . . . . . . . O X X . . . . X | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

However Leelazero thinks that Black wouldn't come out immediately, so White can protect afterwards:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$W $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O X . | $$ | . . . X . . . . X . . . . . . X O X . | $$ | . . X , . X . . . , . . . . . X O X . | $$ | . . O O . . . . . . . . . . O X X O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . O | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X X X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O O 2 O X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O 3 O X . . | $$ | . . O O . . . . . . 5 . X X O O X . . | $$ | . O . X . . . 4 . . . . . O X X X X X | $$ | . . O X . . . . . , . . . O O O O O O | $$ | . O X . . X . 1 . . . O O O X X X X O | $$ | . . . X . . . . . . . O X X . . . . X | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

and even if he does, White can save both groups.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$W $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O X . | $$ | . . . X . . . . X . . . . . . X O X . | $$ | . . X , . X . . . , . . . . . X O X . | $$ | . . O O . . . . . . . . . . O X X O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . O | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . 9 . . , . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . 8 . . O X X X X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O O 2 O X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O 3 O X . . | $$ | . . O O . . . . 6 . 4 . X X O O X . . | $$ | . O . X . . . 5 . 7 . . . O X X X X X | $$ | . . O X . . . . . , . . . O O O O O O | $$ | . O X . . X . 1 . . . O O O X X X X O | $$ | . . . X . . . . . . . O X X . . . . X | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Ian Butler · Post by **Ian Butler** » Sat Dec 07, 2019 5:00 am

Game 7 was a return to simple reverse komi.
But it was fairly one dimensional. I never got any grip on the game and jlt proved too strong all around.
Arguably my biggest downfall for this game was my very limited reading ability and not having the perseverance to try and read something out, taking a few minutes.

jlt · Post by **jlt** » Sat Dec 07, 2019 7:45 am

I reviewed the game with Katago until move 60. I didn't go further because Katago repeatedly wanted both players to play at N3. When I finally decided to do that, it was almost game over.

During the game, I was happy to find

, but actually this move doesn't work, I should have used the other cut... At move 41, you had an opportunity to reverse the game.

jlt · Post by **jlt** » Sat Dec 07, 2019 8:22 am

Also, after move 240 we both passed because White had won anyway, but there was still an endgame move left (other than the one on the top right).

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$W White to play $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . O X | $$ | . O . . . X . O O X O O O X O . O O X | $$ | O . O O O O . O X O O X O X O , . O X | $$ | X O O X X O O X X O X X X X O O O X . | $$ | X X X X X X O O X X O O . X X O X . X | $$ | . . . X O X O . X . X O O O O O X X . | $$ | . . X X O O . O X X . X O O X X . X . | $$ | . . . X X O . . O O X . X O O X X . . | $$ | . . . X O O . . O X X . X X X , . . . | $$ | . . . . X O O . O O X X X X . O . X . | $$ | . . . X X X X O . O O X O X X X X X X | $$ | . . X O X O X O O X X X O O X O X O O | $$ | . . X O O O O X X X X O X O O O X X O | $$ | . . X X O . O O O X O O . . . O X O O | $$ | . O O X X O . . . O O . . O O O O . . | $$ | . X X O O O . . . . . O O X X X O O O | $$ | . . X O . . . . . . . O X X X . X X O | $$ | . . X X O . . . . . . O O X X X . X X | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Ian Butler · Post by **Ian Butler** » Sun Dec 22, 2019 4:07 am

Game 8 was another one with 2 handicap stones.
For me, I went into the game and I only wanted to focus on the following: make safe moves first, then big moves. If a group is already alive, take a big move elsewhere.
Sometimes I forgot about that, of course, but I think I played a lot less small moves than last game. That, and the extra handicap stone, were enough to take the lead and win the game, I reckon.

jlt · Post by **jlt** » Sun Dec 22, 2019 5:17 am

That game was pretty hard for me. Katago says you were leading by 20-40 points during all the game, I never had any chance. Here are a few Katago-assisted comments, until move 121.

So there are 2 games left. Maybe we could go back to 1-stone handicap with reverse komi so that

1) If you win game 9, then game 10 will be even

2) If I win game 9, then game 10 will be with 2 stones again?

Life In 19x19

jlt - Ian Butler Jubango (Game #8)

Re: jlt - Ian Butler Jubango (Game #5)

Re: jlt - Ian Butler Jubango (Game #5)

Re: jlt - Ian Butler Jubango (Game #5)

Re: jlt - Ian Butler Jubango (Game #5)

Re: jlt - Ian Butler Jubango (Game #6)

Re: jlt - Ian Butler Jubango (Game #6)

Re: jlt - Ian Butler Jubango (Game #7)

Re: jlt - Ian Butler Jubango (Game #7)

Re: jlt - Ian Butler Jubango (Game #7)

Re: jlt - Ian Butler Jubango (Game #8)