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Offline jann
 Post subject: Sokogoban
Post #1 Posted: Tue Jun 04, 2019 10:16 pm 
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https://www.increpare.com/game/sokogoban.html
Someone posted on reddit. The "X to action" part is a bit misleading, no extra action other than start.

This post by jann was liked by 3 people: Bonobo, Charlie, HermanHiddema
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Offline Bonobo
 Post subject: Re: Sokogoban
Post #2 Posted: Wed Jun 05, 2019 5:02 am 
Oza
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Yeah, but after “start” you need to press “X” once or twice to continue. Later, “r” to reset the game.

Nice game :) thanks! But I failed on level 2 already :-?

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Offline Charlie
 Post subject: Re: Sokogoban
Post #3 Posted: Wed Jun 05, 2019 6:08 am 
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Another vital hint that isn't given: you can move the "stones" of both colours.
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Offline Tryss
 Post subject: Re: Sokogoban
Post #4 Posted: Wed Jun 05, 2019 6:34 am 
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And as it is, I don't think you can beat lvl 3 :

Nothing in a 4 stone square can move without capture), so you only have two white stones that can move. But the stone on the right side can only move along the right side

That means that the two black stones in the square can never be captured.
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Offline jann
 Post subject: Re: Sokogoban
Post #5 Posted: Wed Jun 05, 2019 6:35 am 
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Charlie wrote:
Another vital hint that isn't given: you can move the "stones" of both colours.

Thats pretty obvious even for the first level, isn't it?

Bonobo wrote:
But I failed on level 2 already :-?

It's actually level 3 thats supposed to be the final challenge, like others I got stuck for hours. There is an interesting psychological effect.
The key is how you can abandon unfruitful approaches and find new ones.

I first tried it with an open mind, expecting several levels, and solved level 2 rather fast. On level 3 I almost proven myself why impossible. "The 2x2 block is stuck, the rightmost white cannot be moved, and it's not possible to capture with 3 whites". (Edit: Tryss posted similar arguments meanwhile.) Later I got back to level 2 and somehow forgot how I did it before, and it seemed harder. Again my brain started to explain why it seems impossible ("if I capture 1 or 2 in the corner the resulting whites useless") instead of solving it.

Though these mental excuses actually help in solutions too, here.

This post by jann was liked by: Bonobo
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Offline HermanHiddema
 Post subject: Re: Sokogoban
Post #6 Posted: Wed Jun 05, 2019 6:52 am 
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@Tryss: Level 3 is possible, but you have to think outside the box :)

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Offline Tryss
 Post subject: Re: Sokogoban
Post #7 Posted: Wed Jun 05, 2019 7:15 am 
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Oh, right ! I discarded this possibility too hastly :salute:
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Offline jann
 Post subject: Re: Sokogoban
Post #8 Posted: Wed Jun 05, 2019 12:44 pm 
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Instead of a 4th level: the ice cube
I wasn't into these things... :)
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Offline Bonobo
 Post subject: Re: Sokogoban
Post #9 Posted: Wed Jun 05, 2019 4:31 pm 
Oza
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HermanHiddema wrote:
@Tryss: Level 3 is possible, but you have to think outside the box :)

Yeah, finally … that was FUN!
Attachment:
Screen Shot 2019-06-05 at 17.11.51.png
Screen Shot 2019-06-05 at 17.11.51.png [ 42.67 KiB | Viewed 4153 times ]

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Offline Fedya
 Post subject: Re: Sokogoban
Post #10 Posted: Sun Jun 09, 2019 4:29 pm 
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jann wrote:
Instead of a 4th level: the ice cube
I wasn't into these things... :)

I solved it
by opening up the level editor and adding a third block :)
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Offline jann
 Post subject: Re: Sokogoban
Post #11 Posted: Sun Jun 09, 2019 5:09 pm 
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There is a more elegant way. :)
The other day I showed it to my nephew (11 years old kid). Took him 20 mins. :scratch:
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Offline Uberdude
 Post subject: Re: Sokogoban
Post #12 Posted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 11:14 pm 
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level 2 took longer than 3 for me (got stuck on 2 and gave up a few days ago, came back today and did them both quickly) :scratch: but had I not done 2 probably 3 would have taken longer as there was a nice progression of learning the game mechanics.

My problem with 2 was initially I wanted to be unnecessarily efficient and capture with just two whites in corner and then was aiming to move the whites around rather than creating a reusable capturing site with mostly black movement.

The logical 'paradox' element of 3 actually provided me a crux of how to solve it as I knew manipulation which didn't alter that aspect was pointless so it actually reduced the space of possible good moves. Rather like how (go playing friend) Alex Selby solved the Eternity puzzle and won himself and partner a million quid. http://www.archduke.org/eternity/
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Offline phillip1882
 Post subject: Re: Sokogoban
Post #13 Posted: Fri Jun 21, 2019 4:49 pm 
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i'm thinking of creating a computer program to solve level 2 and above, as stated before for level 2, capturing 1 or 2 in the corner leaves white with not enough stones to capture the remaining, and it's not possible, or at least i don't see how, to capture all three.
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Offline lightvector
 Post subject: Re: Sokogoban
Post #14 Posted: Sun Jun 23, 2019 9:16 am 
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Hint for those stuck on level 2:

Don't capture in a corner.


Hint for those stuck on level 3:
It *is* possible to move the stones stuck in the 2x2 block, using only basic things you've already figured out.
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Offline phillip1882
 Post subject: Re: Sokogoban
Post #15 Posted: Sun Jun 30, 2019 10:39 am 
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finally solved 2 and 3, and without a computer program.
pretty clever puzzle.
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