Following Nakamura Sumire

[Uberdude]

On mamumamu's list Tanaka Chieko (goratings 1016/1016) is 439 of 444 with a rating of 2,5 (Iyama at top is 9.5). Michael Redmond (goratings 658/1016 with 2 wins 3 losses in last year) is 108/444 with 13 wins 8 losses at 6.97.

[EdLee]

The clip says today July 10, 2019 Wed local time 3:50 pm. Ms. Sumire v. Globis-AQZ.

IMG_4370.PNG (1.04 MiB) Viewed 32192 times

[aeb]

Sumire won her first official tournament game. I transcribed the game from video-broadcast but I was a little late and there was no option to rewind it back. Hopefully since news will be all over it we'll get a proper sgf soon.

See FKisei/23/Q02.sgf.
I have 53 games by Tanaka Chieko, 13 won and 40 lost.

[Ferran]

For whatever its worth,

Nakamura1dan.png (179.4 KiB) Viewed 32099 times

That's got to be the sharpest drop I've seen so far (L wanted G13). Also, Leela didn't like 17, but once done it didn't understand why nobody would settle the damn corner.

Take care.

[Uberdude]

That's got to be the sharpest drop I've seen so far

Park Yeonghun can give Tanaka a run for her money, though admittedly over the course of 3 not 1 moves. viewtopic.php?p=246323#p246323

[Ferran]

Park Yeonghun can give Tanaka a run for her money, though admittedly over the course of 3 not 1 moves.

If I could choose, I'd rather make Park's mistakes than Tanaka's. The game has a different "feel".

Take care.

[TheCannyOnion]

Has Nihon Kiin said anything about Sumire's #$%^&*? Strange that this area hasn't been covered, given all the attention paid to Sumire's other minutiae.

[admin]
Crude phrase removed. -JB
[/admin]

[jlt]

I think of TheCannyOnion more as a pet chihuahua, kept for the amusement of its predictable yapping anytime Iyama or Sumire is mentioned, than a deceitful troll.

Yapping chihuahuas are fine, but more annoying when they poop in your frontyard.

[TheCannyOnion]

Removed.

[ewan1971]

But what I find telling is that in all the CJK countries the pro organisations have a remarkably good (?perfect) record in predicting which kids will be the future stars, even many years before they make the grade (we can exclude the diplomatic diplomas given to westerners, of course). On that basis alone I would be confident that Sumire is on track to become at least one of the strongest female pros.

That's great. Then why didn't the Kiin grant Sumire that Shodan diploma when she actually makes the grade? Why the premature and highly irregular certification, bypassing the pro exam, which is the way vast majority of pros become pros?

I'm a bit of a traditionalist on this particular matter, so I find Sumire's promotion and the subsequent coverage a bit nauseating, for a lack of better word.

[Ferran]

That's great. Then why didn't the Kiin grant Sumire that Shodan diploma when she actually makes the grade? Why the premature and highly irregular certification, bypassing the pro exam, which is the way vast majority of pros become pros?

I'm a bit of a traditionalist on this particular matter, so I find Sumire's promotion and the subsequent coverage a bit nauseating, for a lack of better word.

Well, there IS a tradition of irregularity in Japanese Go. IF you want a "refresher" check the history of THE Meijin, or that of the precursors to the Kiin. Or the birth of the Kansai Kiin. Or...

While I do share part of your feelings regarding Sumire-sensei, Japanese rules are... more like guidelines, in a very Pratchett-Weatherwax sense. If there's enough of a reason or a consensus, a rule is discarded as it was never there, then immediately put back in place. For example, these rules are discarded quite often when dealing with interested foreigners. And I suspect that the fact that she was made SHOdan is also an important part of the mindset. That the Japanese language does not have "First" dan and instead has "small" dan, speaks volumes.

My gut feeling of wrongness is there, but, then, Japan does have a tradition of putting impossibly young people in the spotlight *as part* of their training.

Take care.

[Uberdude]

Sumire won a game in the female Kisei prelims.

[Zenit]

That the Japanese language does not have "First" dan and instead has "small" dan, speaks volumes.

Well, the sho in shodan (初段) actually does mean "first".

On another note, Nakamura is now 2-1 in her official matches. That's pretty good for someone who supposedly has no business being a pro. Did she just get lucky two times in a row?

[jlt]

Kim Hyun Jung (or Jong) is 982th out of 1015 on goratings, and rated 2641 Elo:

https://www.goratings.org/en/players/1013.html

so she is one of the weakest professionals, certainly weaker than the European pros. It's hard at the moment to compare Nakamura Sumire's strength to European pros, we will know when she plays against 2800-2900 Elo rated players.

[Mike Novack]

On another note, Nakamura is now 2-1 in her official matches. That's pretty good for someone who supposedly has no business being a pro. Did she just get lucky two times in a row?

I am actually finding the discussion strange. Particularly the arguement that she shouldn't be considered of pro rank because she is only beating weaker pros!

I suspect that she is only the first in what will be a new process. The TRADITION was that regardless of strength as a child, one still had to go through a particular traditional student system. I think the wisdom of that is being rethought, and she is just the first of what will be many << selected for this "honor" because an attractive child for the break with tradition.

WHY? Why do I think it a good idea for those (few) who show such strength at an early age that it is obvious they will not only be pro strength but possibly well up in the ranks by the time in their later teens. Because it limits/defines their education too soon. We don't KNOW that she will end up as a go professional (I'm not talking about rank)