56. Violence(?d) vs Magicwand(3d)

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topazg
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Re: 56. Violence(?d) vs Magicwand(3d)

Post by topazg »

@LiKao:

Have a look at my sequence - I think all that is sente for White.
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Joaz Banbeck
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Re: 56. Violence(?d) vs Magicwand(3d)

Post by Joaz Banbeck »

Li Kao wrote:
Is 3 sente or gote?


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . X X O . . . O X . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | X . X O . . O . X X . O . X . X O . . |
$$ | X X O O . . . O O X . . X . . X X O . |
$$ | O O O . . O . . O O X X X O X O X O . |
$$ | . X O B b . . . . X O . . . O O O O . |
$$ | . X X O O X X X O O . . . . . . X X . |
$$ | 5 . X X O O . . X . . . . . O O O O X |
$$ | . . X . X O . X . X . . . X X O O X . |
$$ | . . X X 3 a . X . X . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | . O X O O O . X X O . X X X . . . X . |
$$ | 1 X 2 X O X O O O . O . O . . . O O . |
$$ | O X X O O X O X X . O . O . O O . . O |
$$ | . O O . . X X O . X . X . . O X O O X |
$$ | . . . . . X O O . . . . . . . X X X X |
$$ | . . X O . X O X X X . . . X . X . . . |
$$ | . . O O . O . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O O X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Move 3 looks like sente to me. The vital point is 5, and if white gets there first, I think black dies.
Help make L19 more organized. Make an index: https://lifein19x19.com/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=5207
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Re: 56. Violence(?d) vs Magicwand(3d)

Post by Violence »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1 Prisoners: W=6, B=11
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . X X O . . . O X . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | X . X O . . O . X X . O . X . X O . . |
$$ | X X O O . . . O O X . . X . . X X O . |
$$ | O O O . . O . . O O X X X O X O X O . |
$$ | . X O X . . . . . X O . . . O O O O . |
$$ | . X X O O X X X O O . . . . . . X X . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . X . . . . . O O O O X |
$$ | . . X . X O . X . X . . . X X O O X . |
$$ | . . X X . . . X . X . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | . O X O O O . X X O . X X X . . . X . |
$$ | W X . X O X O O O . O . O . . . O O . |
$$ | O X X O O X O X X . O . O . O O . . O |
$$ | . O O . . X X O . X . X . . O X O O X |
$$ | . . . . . X O O . . . . . . . X X X X |
$$ | . . X O . X O X X X . . . X . X . . . |
$$ | . . O O . O . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O O X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Seems straightforward enough...
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Re: 56. Violence(?d) vs Magicwand(3d)

Post by Magicwand »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1 Prisoners: W=6, B=11
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . X X O . . . O X . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | X . X O . . O . X X . O . X . X O . . |
$$ | X X O O . . . O O X . . X . . X X O . |
$$ | O O O . . O . . O O X X X O X O X O . |
$$ | . X O X . . . . . X O . . . O O O O . |
$$ | . X X O O X X X O O . . . . . . X X . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . X . . . . . O O O O X |
$$ | . . X . X O . X . X . . . X X O O X . |
$$ | . . X X . . . X . X . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | . O X O O O . X X O . X X X . . . X . |
$$ | O X B X O X O O O . O . O . . . O O . |
$$ | O X X O O X O X X . O . O . O O . . O |
$$ | . O O . . X X O . X . X . . O X O O X |
$$ | . . . . . X O O . . . . . . . X X X X |
$$ | . . X O . X O X X X . . . X . X . . . |
$$ | . . O O . O . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O O X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
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Re: 56. Violence(?d) vs Magicwand(3d)

Post by Violence »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1 Prisoners: W=6, B=11
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . X X O . . . O X . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | X . X O . . O . X X . O . X . X O . . |
$$ | X X O O . . . O O X . . X . . X X O . |
$$ | O O O . . O . . O O X X X O X O X O . |
$$ | . X O X . . . . . X O . . . O O O O . |
$$ | . X X O O X X X O O . . . . . . X X . |
$$ | . . X X O O . . X . . . . . O O O O X |
$$ | . . X . X O . X . X . . . X X O O X . |
$$ | . . X X W . . X . X . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | . O X O O O . X X O . X X X . . . X . |
$$ | O X X X O X O O O . O . O . . . O O . |
$$ | O X X O O X O X X . O . O . O O . . O |
$$ | . O O . . X X O . X . X . . O X O O X |
$$ | . . . . . X O O . . . . . . . X X X X |
$$ | . . X O . X O X X X . . . X . X . . . |
$$ | . . O O . O . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O O X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
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Re: 56. Violence(?d) vs Magicwand(3d)

Post by Magicwand »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoners: W=6, B=11
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . X X O . . . O X . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | X . X O . . O . X X . O . X . X O . . |
$$ | X X O O . . . O O X . . X . . X X O . |
$$ | O O O . . O . . O O X X X O X O X O . |
$$ | 6 X O X . . . . . X O . . . O O O O . |
$$ | . X X O O X X X O O . . . . . . X X . |
$$ | 5 . X X O O . . X . . . . . O O O O X |
$$ | . 7 X . X O . X . X . . . X X O O X . |
$$ | 3 1 X X O . . X . X . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | 2 O X O O O . X X O . X X X . . . X . |
$$ | O X X X O X O O O . O . O . . . O O . |
$$ | O X X O O X O X X . O . O . O O . . O |
$$ | 4 O O . . X X O . X . X . . O X O O X |
$$ | . . . . . X O O . . . . . . . X X X X |
$$ | . . X O . X O X X X . . . X . X . . . |
$$ | . . O O . O . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O O X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
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Re: 56. Violence(?d) vs Magicwand(3d)

Post by Violence »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoners: W=6, B=11
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . X X O . . . O X . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | X . X O . . O . X X . O . X . X O . . |
$$ | X X O O . . . O O X . . X . . X X O . |
$$ | O O O . . O . . O O X X X O X O X O . |
$$ | O X O X . . . . . X O . . . O O O O . |
$$ | . X X O O X X X O O . . . . . . X X . |
$$ | X . X X O O . . X . . . . . O O O O X |
$$ | . X X . X O . X . X . . . X X O O X . |
$$ | X X X X O . . X . X . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | O O X O O O . X X O . X X X . . . X . |
$$ | O X X X O X O O O . O . O . . . O O . |
$$ | O X X O O X O X X . O . O . O O . . O |
$$ | O O O . . X X O . X . X . . O X O O X |
$$ | . . . . . X O O . . . . W . . X X X X |
$$ | . . X O . X O X X X . . . X . X . . . |
$$ | . . O O . O . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O O X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Ok... my postulate was that if I got both the reduction on the left and the reductions down here, I would win by a very comfortable margin after avoiding the ko.

I think I can breath a sigh of relief here, because I wasn't sure what would happen if he made the endgame chaotic.
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Re: 56. Violence(?d) vs Magicwand(3d)

Post by Magicwand »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoners: W=6, B=11
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . X X O . . . O X . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | X . X O . . O . X X . O . X . X O . . |
$$ | X X O O . . . O O X . . X . . X X O . |
$$ | O O O . . O . . O O X X X O X O X O . |
$$ | O X O X . . . . . X O . . . O O O O . |
$$ | . X X O O X X X O O . . . . . . X X . |
$$ | X . X X O O . . X . . . . . O O O O X |
$$ | . X X . X O . X . X . . . X X O O X . |
$$ | X X X X O . . X . X . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | O O X O O O . X X O . X X X . . . X . |
$$ | O X X X O X O O O . O . O . . . O O . |
$$ | O X X O O X O X X . O . O . O O . . O |
$$ | O O O . . X X O . X . X . . O X O O X |
$$ | . . . . . X O O . . . . O . . X X X X |
$$ | . . X O . X O X X X . . B X . X . . . |
$$ | . . O O . O . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O O X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
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Re: 56. Violence(?d) vs Magicwand(3d)

Post by Violence »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoners: W=6, B=11
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . X X O . . . O X . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | X . X O . . O . X X . O . X . X O . . |
$$ | X X O O . . . O O X . . X . . X X O . |
$$ | O O O . . O . . O O X X X O X O X O . |
$$ | O X O X . . . . . X O . . . O O O O . |
$$ | . X X O O X X X O O . . . . . . X X . |
$$ | X . X X O O . . X . . . . . O O O O X |
$$ | . X X . X O . X . X . . . X X O O X . |
$$ | X X X X O . . X . X . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | O O X O O O . X X O . X X X . . . X . |
$$ | O X X X O X O O O . O . O . . . O O . |
$$ | O X X O O X O X X . O . O . O O . . O |
$$ | O O O . . X X O . X . X . . O X O O X |
$$ | . . . . . X O O . . . W O . . X X X X |
$$ | . . X O . X O X X X . . X X . X . . . |
$$ | . . O O . O . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O O X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


So my feeling is that White is ahead by around komi, but I haven't counted yet. It's almost to the point where I can count semi accurately.
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Re: 56. Violence(?d) vs Magicwand(3d)

Post by Magicwand »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoners: W=6, B=11
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . X X O . . . O X . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | X . X O . . O . X X . O . X . X O . . |
$$ | X X O O . . . O O X . . X . B X X O . |
$$ | O O O . . O . . O O X X X O X O X O . |
$$ | O X O X . . . . . X O . . . O O O O . |
$$ | . X X O O X X X O O . . . . . . X X . |
$$ | X . X X O O . . X . . . . . O O O O X |
$$ | . X X . X O . X . X . . . X X O O X . |
$$ | X X X X O . . X . X . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | O O X O O O . X X O . X X X . . . X . |
$$ | O X X X O X O O O . O . O . . . O O . |
$$ | O X X O O X O X X . O . O . O O . . O |
$$ | O O O . . X X O . X . X . . O X O O X |
$$ | . . . . . X O O . . . O O . . X X X X |
$$ | . . X O . X O X X X . . X X . X . . . |
$$ | . . O O . O . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O O X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

just as i expected he played gote.
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The greater the unknown"

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Re: 56. Violence(?d) vs Magicwand(3d)

Post by Violence »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoners: W=6, B=11
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . X X O . . . O X . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | X . X O . . O . X X . O . X . X O . . |
$$ | X X O O . . . O O X . . X . X X X O . |
$$ | O O O . . O . . O O X X X O X O X O . |
$$ | O X O X . . . . . X O . . W O O O O . |
$$ | . X X O O X X X O O . . . . . . X X . |
$$ | X . X X O O . . X . . . . . O O O O X |
$$ | . X X . X O . X . X . . . X X O O X . |
$$ | X X X X O . . X . X . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | O O X O O O . X X O . X X X . . . X . |
$$ | O X X X O X O O O . O . O . . . O O . |
$$ | O X X O O X O X X . O . O . O O . . O |
$$ | O O O . . X X O . X . X . . O X O O X |
$$ | . . . . . X O O . . . O O . . X X X X |
$$ | . . X O . X O X X X . . X X . X . . . |
$$ | . . O O . O . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O O X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


His tesuji at S18 shouldn't work if I play here...
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Re: 56. Violence(?d) vs Magicwand(3d)

Post by Magicwand »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoners: W=6, B=11
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . X X O . . . O X . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | X . X O . . O . X X . O . X . X O . . |
$$ | X X O O . . . O O X . . X B X X X O . |
$$ | O O O . . O . . O O X X X O X O X O . |
$$ | O X O X . . . . . X O . . O O O O O . |
$$ | . X X O O X X X O O . . . . . . X X . |
$$ | X . X X O O . . X . . . . . O O O O X |
$$ | . X X . X O . X . X . . . X X O O X . |
$$ | X X X X O . . X . X . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | O O X O O O . X X O . X X X . . . X . |
$$ | O X X X O X O O O . O . O . . . O O . |
$$ | O X X O O X O X X . O . O . O O . . O |
$$ | O O O . . X X O . X . X . . O X O O X |
$$ | . . . . . X O O . . . O O . . X X X X |
$$ | . . X O . X O X X X . . X X . X . . . |
$$ | . . O O . O . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O O X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
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The greater the unknown"

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Re: 56. Violence(?d) vs Magicwand(3d)

Post by Violence »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoners: W=6, B=11
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . X X O . . . O X . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | X . X O . . O . X X . O . X . X O . . |
$$ | X X O O . . . O O X . . X X X X X O . |
$$ | O O O . . O . . O O X X X O X O X O . |
$$ | O X O X . . . . . X O . . O O O O O . |
$$ | . X X O O X X X O O . . . . . . X X . |
$$ | X . X X O O . . X . . . . . O O O O X |
$$ | . X X . X O . X . X . . . X X O O X . |
$$ | X X X X O . . X . X . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | O O X O O O . X X O . X X X . . . X . |
$$ | O X X X O X O O O . O . O . . . O O . |
$$ | O X X O O X O X X . O . O . O O . . O |
$$ | O O O . . X X O . X W X . . O X O O X |
$$ | . . . . . X O O . . . O O . . X X X X |
$$ | . . X O . X O X X X . . X X . X . . . |
$$ | . . O O . O . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O O X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I have to play here... otherwise, I can't get two eyes, and would have to spend 3 moves capturing those F5 stones.

I don't like allowing the tesuji on the top right, but this is just too big.

I also have the followup of capturing two stones.

Now that I think about it, I think M5 was a mistake... I should've played at L6 first. This way I'm guaranteed an eye and don't have to spend two moves here.

I can't believe I can miss something this simple. I feel dumb.

EDIT: AND the s18 tesuji doesn't even work! I have s19!

Wow, I'm dumb.

EDIT AGAIN: AGJSKFDSAJFKAG I have to stop reading badly.

S18 still works.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoners: W=6, B=11
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | X . . . . . . . . . . . . . 8 X 3 2 5 |
$$ | . X X O . . . O X . . . . . 6 4 O 1 . |
$$ | X . X O . . O . X X . O . X . X O 7 . |
$$ | X X O O . . . O O X . . X B X X X O . |
$$ | O O O . . O . . O O X X X O X O X O . |
$$ | O X O X . . . . . X O . . O O O O O . |
$$ | . X X O O X X X O O . . . . . . X X . |
$$ | X . X X O O . . X . . . . . O O O O X |
$$ | . X X . X O . X . X . . . X X O O X . |
$$ | X X X X O . . X . X . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | O O X O O O . X X O . X X X . . . X . |
$$ | O X X X O X O O O . O . O . . . O O . |
$$ | O X X O O X O X X . O . O . O O . . O |
$$ | O O O . . X X O . X W X . . O X O O X |
$$ | . . . . . X O O . . . O O . . X X X X |
$$ | . . X O . X O X X X . . X X . X . . . |
$$ | . . O O . O . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O O X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I lose by 1 lib.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoners: W=6, B=11
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | X . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6 X 3 2 5 |
$$ | . X X O . . . O X . . . . . . 4 O 1 . |
$$ | X . X O . . O . X X . O . X . X O 7 . |
$$ | X X O O . . . O O X . . X B X X X O . |
$$ | O O O . . O . . O O X X X O X O X O . |
$$ | O X O X . . . . . X O . . O O O O O . |
$$ | . X X O O X X X O O . . . . . . X X . |
$$ | X . X X O O . . X . . . . . O O O O X |
$$ | . X X . X O . X . X . . . X X O O X . |
$$ | X X X X O . . X . X . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | O O X O O O . X X O . X X X . . . X . |
$$ | O X X X O X O O O . O . O . . . O O . |
$$ | O X X O O X O X X . O . O . O O . . O |
$$ | O O O . . X X O . X W X . . O X O O X |
$$ | . . . . . X O O . . . O O . . X X X X |
$$ | . . X O . X O X X X . . X X . X . . . |
$$ | . . O O . O . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O O X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Best I can get here is ko, which I don't want to fight.

So it seems the tesuji works.
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Magicwand
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Re: 56. Violence(?d) vs Magicwand(3d)

Post by Magicwand »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Prisoners: W=6, B=11
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . X X O . . . O X . . . . . . . O B . |
$$ | X . X O . . O . X X . O . X . X O . . |
$$ | X X O O . . . O O X . . X X X X X O . |
$$ | O O O . . O . . O O X X X O X O X O . |
$$ | O X O X . . . . . X O . . O O O O O . |
$$ | . X X O O X X X O O . . . . . . X X . |
$$ | X . X X O O . . X . . . . . O O O O X |
$$ | . X X . X O . X . X . . . X X O O X . |
$$ | X X X X O . . X . X . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | O O X O O O . X X O . X X X . . . X . |
$$ | O X X X O X O O O . O . O . . . O O . |
$$ | O X X O O X O X X . O . O . O O . . O |
$$ | O O O . . X X O . X O X . . O X O O X |
$$ | . . . . . X O O . . . O O . . X X X X |
$$ | . . X O . X O X X X . . X X . X . . . |
$$ | . . O O . O . O . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O O O X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
yea..he didnt see that?? unexpected..
i will distroy his points in sente and now i have comfortable lead :)
"The more we think we know about
The greater the unknown"

Words by neil peart, music by geddy lee and alex lifeson
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Bantari
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Re: 56. Violence(?d) vs Magicwand(3d)

Post by Bantari »

I swear, this game is a comedy. Lol.
- Bantari
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