19 point squeeze trick play

Knotwilg · #1

In my last game the opponent pulled the 19 point trick play on me but failed during the execution. In the review with KataGo I came across novel insights on the trick play:

https://senseis.xmp.net/?NineteenPointTrickPlay

kvasir · #2

You show this on senseis's

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$W $$ ------------------ $$ | . . . 5 . O . . . $$ | . . 3 X X O X . . $$ | . O . X O O X . . $$ | . . X X O O X . . $$ | . 1 O O X O . . . $$ | . . . 2 X 6 4 . . $$ | . . X . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . , . . . . .[/go]

Without starting the engines I want to ask about the following diagram.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$W $$ ------------------ $$ | . . . . . O . . . $$ | 5 4 6 X X O X . . $$ | . O . X O O X . . $$ | 3 2 X X O O X . . $$ | . 1 O O X O . . . $$ | . . . . X . . . . $$ | . . X . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . , . . . . .[/go]

Knotwilg · #3

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$W $$ ------------------ $$ | . . . 5 3 O . . . $$ | O X X X X O X . . $$ | 9 O 0 X O O X . . $$ | O X X X O O X . . $$ | 7 O O O X O 1 . . $$ | 8 4 6 2 X . . . . $$ | . . X . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . , . . . . .[/go]

Yeah, let's think a little without the engines

The question then is: can White avoid the squeeze? From the outside, Black wins the capturing race.

I'll check later. Perhaps the answer here is that it's affordable to play this way and claim/attack the top on a large scale.

Knotwilg · #4

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$W $$ ------------------ $$ | . . . . . O . . . $$ | 5 4 6 X X O X . . $$ | . O . X O O X . . $$ | 3 2 X X O O X . . $$ | . 1 O O X O . . . $$ | . . 0 . X 9 . . . $$ | . 7 X . . . . . . $$ | . 8 . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . , . . . . .[/go]

The key move here seems to be :w7:

allowing to get out of the squeeze by setting up a ladder at :w9:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$W $$ ------------------ $$ | . 4 . . . O . . . $$ | O X X X X O X . . $$ | . O . X O O X . . $$ | O X X X O O X . . $$ | 3 O O O X O . . . $$ | . 1 X . X O . 7 . $$ | 5 O X . a . . . . $$ | . X 2 . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . , . . . . . $$ | . . 6 . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . .[/go]

The corner becomes seki and the fighting may continue on either side. The result is fairly even.
Note that an atari at A would disturb the seki and White would have to fill an outside liberty. In other words A is gote for White.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$W $$ ------------------ $$ | 8 5 6 C 7 O . . . $$ | O X X X X O X . . $$ | 9 O . X O O X . . $$ | O X X X O O X . . $$ | 3 O O O X O . . . $$ | C 1 X C X O . . . $$ | 4 O X . a . . . . $$ | 0 X 2 . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . , . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . .[/go]

It would be unwise for Black to play :w4:

here instead, for the corner will become an approach ko for Black.

kvasir · #5

Looks legit but I'd point out that white has already gained 4-5 points with the hamate at this point.

I have been looking at the only game I could find of pros playing this trick move, well it is a 2 stone handicap game with Shusaku taking black and avoiding the hamate in a way that losses ~3 pts.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$c $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . , X . . . . , . . . O . X . . . | $$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . O . X X X . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X O O . | $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . X . O O X X . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O O X O . O . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . O X X X , . X . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . O X . . . X X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . O X X X . O X . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . O O O O X . O X X . | $$ | . . . . . . . . O X O O X O . O . O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . X X X O O . O . . | $$ | . . . X . X . . . , X O O O X O . O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X X X X O O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

I find it interesting to consider which moves the computer considers to be bad in the standard "fall for it" line, that is how do we lose ~30pts playing like this.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$B $$ ------------------ $$ | . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . 4 2 3 . . . $$ | . . . O 1 5 O . . $$ | . . . 6 X . . . . $$ | . . X 7 8 9 . . . $$ | . . . . 0 . . . . $$ | . . O . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . .[/go]

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Bm11 $$ ------------------ $$ | . . . . . 3 . . . $$ | . . . O O X 2 . . $$ | . 1 . O X X O . . $$ | . 7 6 O X 5 4 . . $$ | . 8 X X O X . . . $$ | . 9 0 . O . . . . $$ | . . O . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . .[/go]

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Bm21 $$ ------------------ $$ | . . . 7 9 X 0 . . $$ | . . 5 O O X O . . $$ | . X . O X X O . . $$ | . X O O X X O . . $$ | 1 3 X X O X 8 . . $$ | . X O 2 O 6 4 . . $$ | . . O . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . .[/go]

Using my arbitrary rule that bad move is >=1.5 pts loss, then :b9:

and

are bad. Notice how the last 4 black moves are bad, this is a pitfall for many diagrams, basically black keeps making mistakes after the first mistake. If :b9:

is anyway bad, then we need to change that move but here we have given white a clear opportunity to go all-out in the fight. Starting an unpredictable fight must be a success for white when he plays a trick move in order to create any chance to win like in the Shusaku game.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Bm9 $$ ------------------ $$ | . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . O O X . . . $$ | . . . O X X O . . $$ | . . . O X . 1 . . $$ | . . X X O . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . O . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . .[/go]

The only way to avoid the trick without compromising or allowing white to start a huge fight appears to be the traditional way.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Bm9 $$ ------------------ $$ | . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . 2 . . . . $$ | . . . O 1 . O . . $$ | . . . . X . . . . $$ | . . X . . . . . . $$ | . . . . 3 . . . . $$ | . . O . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . . $$ | . . . . . . . . .[/go]

Btw, black has a more effective way to counter attack in the Shusaku game.

19 point squeeze trick play

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