Kirby's Study Journal

Create a study plan, track your progress and hold yourself accountable.
Kirby
Honinbo
Posts: 9553
Joined: Wed Feb 24, 2010 6:04 pm
GD Posts: 0
KGS: Kirby
Tygem: 커비라고해
Has thanked: 1583 times
Been thanked: 1707 times

Re: Kirby's Study Journal

Post by Kirby »

Trying to keep up with playing games, so I fired up the ol' VM, and started up Tygem. I haven't played on Tygem in ages - my last game is from July 2019. I'm 4d there, so I played a game.

Here it is:



Looking at the very big picture, of course, I was too aggressive and tried to kill his group... And died. Somehow, I was redeemed near the end when he messed up a capturing race.
be immersed
Kirby
Honinbo
Posts: 9553
Joined: Wed Feb 24, 2010 6:04 pm
GD Posts: 0
KGS: Kirby
Tygem: 커비라고해
Has thanked: 1583 times
Been thanked: 1707 times

Re: Kirby's Study Journal

Post by Kirby »

Some highlights...

Here, I should have read things out more carefully before switching to, "Imma gonna kill you" mode.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X O . . . . . . . . . . . X O X . |
$$ | . O X O . . . . . , . X . X . X X O . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . . . . X . X O . |
$$ | X . X . . . . . . . . . O O O O O O . |
$$ | . X . . . . . . . . . B . X O . O X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O O X X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X X O O X . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X X X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O O O O O . . |
$$ | . . . O . X . . . , . . X X . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . . . X . . . . . X . O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Whether or not this move works, I did not read out the obvious danger of his counter attack. His moves weren't that surprising, but just a few moves later, I was feeling like I was in trouble. It means I didn't think about it much.

Actually, I'm going to stop there for my own highlights... I think the moral here is: look twice before crossing the road. I need to take attacks seriously, and consider my weaknesses before I switch on an attack.
be immersed
Kirby
Honinbo
Posts: 9553
Joined: Wed Feb 24, 2010 6:04 pm
GD Posts: 0
KGS: Kirby
Tygem: 커비라고해
Has thanked: 1583 times
Been thanked: 1707 times

Re: Kirby's Study Journal

Post by Kirby »

Looked at the game with an AI.

Some points..

Here, AI wants to just descend, and says I lost a lot by my choice:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . X . X . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X B . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X X O O . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . O . . |
$$ | . . . O . X . . . , . . X X . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . . . X . . . . . X . O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Furthermore, after white lives in the top right, AI is more interested in the top left corner... Doesn't really care about attacking the black group immediately. I suppose the takeaway is that it's valuable to keep black weak like that, even if there's not an immediate attack.

I wonder if I can tie the two learnings together:
* Instead of going ALL OUT for an attack, it's good enough to put out reasonable force.
* This may be necessary in times where I am weak.
be immersed
dust
Lives with ko
Posts: 161
Joined: Sun Feb 28, 2016 4:01 am
GD Posts: 0
Has thanked: 138 times
Been thanked: 23 times

Re: Kirby's Study Journal

Post by dust »

Kirby wrote: I wonder if I can tie the two learnings together:
* Instead of going ALL OUT for an attack, it's good enough to put out reasonable force.
* This may be necessary in times where I am weak.
I think that may be too rigid a learning, especially the first point.

The problem is that sometimes you do need to go ALL OUT - the position demands it. Sometimes it won't be enough to hold back with 'reasonable force'.
Kirby
Honinbo
Posts: 9553
Joined: Wed Feb 24, 2010 6:04 pm
GD Posts: 0
KGS: Kirby
Tygem: 커비라고해
Has thanked: 1583 times
Been thanked: 1707 times

Re: Kirby's Study Journal

Post by Kirby »

I agree with you, but I think I am a bit blind to my own weaknesses in a given position, so that makes part needs extra attention.
be immersed
dhu163
Lives in gote
Posts: 474
Joined: Tue Jan 05, 2016 6:36 am
Rank: UK 2d Dec15
GD Posts: 0
KGS: mathmo 4d
IGS: mathmo 4d
Has thanked: 62 times
Been thanked: 278 times

Re: Kirby's Study Journal

Post by dhu163 »

Can I ask why Kirby's post above is in my "view your posts" list, which normally only consists of my own posts?

Is this an ad, virus, accident, or UFO?

edit: Ah, I probably misunderstood, and any thread I've commented on shows up if updated. Apologies.
Kirby
Honinbo
Posts: 9553
Joined: Wed Feb 24, 2010 6:04 pm
GD Posts: 0
KGS: Kirby
Tygem: 커비라고해
Has thanked: 1583 times
Been thanked: 1707 times

Re: Kirby's Study Journal

Post by Kirby »

Played another game on Tygem. Got paired against 5d.

I was black:

be immersed
Kirby
Honinbo
Posts: 9553
Joined: Wed Feb 24, 2010 6:04 pm
GD Posts: 0
KGS: Kirby
Tygem: 커비라고해
Has thanked: 1583 times
Been thanked: 1707 times

Re: Kirby's Study Journal

Post by Kirby »

Highlights:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . X X O O O O . . , . . . . . X . O . |
$$ | . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . B X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . O , . . O . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . X . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . O . . O . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X . X O O . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X X . X . . . X X O . O . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X O . . . O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
I think the marked move, above, misses the point. I should just jump out:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . X X O O O O . . , . . . . . X . O . |
$$ | . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O X . X . B . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . O , . . O . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . X . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . O . . O . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X . X O O . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X X . X . . . X X O . O . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X O . . . O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
---
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . X X O O O O . . , . . . . . X . O . |
$$ | . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . X . X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . O , . . O . O , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . O X O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . B . . . X . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . O . . O . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X . X O O . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X X . X . . . X X O . O . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X O . . . O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
The move above is useful, but maybe not as big as jumping:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . . . . . X . . X . . |
$$ | . X X O O O O . . , . . . . . X . O . |
$$ | . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . X . X . B . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . O , . . O . O , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . O X O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . X . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . O . . O . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . X . X O O . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X X . X . . . X X O . O . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X O . . . O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
---
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . O . . O . . O X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X X X O . . . . O . X . . X X . |
$$ | X X X O O O O . . X . . . . . X . O . |
$$ | X O O . . . . . . . . X X . . . . . . |
$$ | O . . . . . . . O . X O . . . . O . . |
$$ | . O . . . . . O . X X O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . X X X X O . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X X . . . . O O O X . . . O . . |
$$ | . . O , . . O . O , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . O X O . . . . . . . . . O O X . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . O X X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . X . . O X . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . O . . O . . . . B . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . X . O . . . X . X O O . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . X X . X . . . X X O . O . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X O . . . O X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
The move above was risky - I didn't read it all out, and if I get captured, I lose points, Counting the board, I think it may not be necessary.

Takeaway: Analyze carefully before taking big risk.
be immersed
Kirby
Honinbo
Posts: 9553
Joined: Wed Feb 24, 2010 6:04 pm
GD Posts: 0
KGS: Kirby
Tygem: 커비라고해
Has thanked: 1583 times
Been thanked: 1707 times

Re: Kirby's Study Journal

Post by Kirby »

I played a game in the AYD, yesterday. He outplayed me, but I think I focused well.

Here is the game:

be immersed
Kirby
Honinbo
Posts: 9553
Joined: Wed Feb 24, 2010 6:04 pm
GD Posts: 0
KGS: Kirby
Tygem: 커비라고해
Has thanked: 1583 times
Been thanked: 1707 times

Re: Kirby's Study Journal

Post by Kirby »

Highlights...

Position 1

Here, I think I missed the most urgent area:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . O . O X O . O . |
$$ | . O X O . . . . . X . X O X X X O . . |
$$ | . O X O . . . . . X . X O O . X O . . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . O . . . X O X . |
$$ | X . X . . . . . . O . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . X . . . . . . . . . O . O X X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X O . O . |
$$ | . X . , . . . . . , . . . . O X X . . |
$$ | . . . O O O . O . . . . . . B . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . . X X O O X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X . . O X X O O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O X X . X . . X O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O X . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . O . O X O X . . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ | O X X O X X . X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Instead, I think I should help the weaker stones:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . O . O X O . O . |
$$ | . O X O . . . . . X . X O X X X O . . |
$$ | . O X O . . . . . X . X O O . X O . . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . O . . . X O X . |
$$ | X . X . . . . . . O . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . X . . . . . . . . . O . O X X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X O . O . |
$$ | . X . , . . . . . , . . . . O X X . . |
$$ | . . . O O O . O . . . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . . X X O O X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X . . O X X O O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O X X . X . . X O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O X . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . O . O X O X . . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ | O X X O X X . X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Position 2
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X O . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . O X O . . . . . X . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . W . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , O . . . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Something was off after white's shoulder hit here.

I ended up in this position:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X O . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . O X O . . . . . X . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . X . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . O O O . O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X X O O X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O X X O O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . X . . X O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , O . . . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
This simply seems good for white. I'm not exactly sure where I went wrong with it, though.

I'll check with an AI shortly.
be immersed
Kirby
Honinbo
Posts: 9553
Joined: Wed Feb 24, 2010 6:04 pm
GD Posts: 0
KGS: Kirby
Tygem: 커비라고해
Has thanked: 1583 times
Been thanked: 1707 times

Re: Kirby's Study Journal

Post by Kirby »

Highlights...

Position 1

Here, I think I missed the most urgent area:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . O . O X O . O . |
$$ | . O X O . . . . . X . X O X X X O . . |
$$ | . O X O . . . . . X . X O O . X O . . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . O . . . X O X . |
$$ | X . X . . . . . . O . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . X . . . . . . . . . O . O X X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X O . O . |
$$ | . X . , . . . . . , . . . . O X X . . |
$$ | . . . O O O . O . . . . . . B . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . . X X O O X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X . . O X X O O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O X X . X . . X O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O X . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . O . O X O X . . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ | O X X O X X . X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Instead, I think I should help the weaker stones:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . O . O X O . O . |
$$ | . O X O . . B . . X . X O X X X O . . |
$$ | . O X O . . . . . X . X O O . X O . . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . O . . . X O X . |
$$ | X . X . . . . . . O . . . . . X X O . |
$$ | . X . . . . . . . . . O . O X X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X O . O . |
$$ | . X . , . . . . . , . . . . O X X . . |
$$ | . . . O O O . O . . . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . . X X O O X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X . . O X X O O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O X X . X . . X O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O X . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . O . O X O X . . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ | O X X O X X . X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Position 2
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X O . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . O X O . . . . . X . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . W . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , O . . . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Something was off after white's shoulder hit here.

I ended up in this position:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X O . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . O X O . . . . . X . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . X . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . O O O . O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X X O O X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O X X O O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . X . . X O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , O . . . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
This simply seems good for white. I'm not exactly sure where I went wrong with it, though.

I'll check with an AI shortly.
be immersed
Kirby
Honinbo
Posts: 9553
Joined: Wed Feb 24, 2010 6:04 pm
GD Posts: 0
KGS: Kirby
Tygem: 커비라고해
Has thanked: 1583 times
Been thanked: 1707 times

Re: Kirby's Study Journal

Post by Kirby »

Two things largely stuck out to me when I analyzed with AI:

AI 1
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X O . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . O X O . . . . . X . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . B . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . O O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , O . . . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Instead of the move above, the AI is wanting to put pressure on the two white stones:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X O . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . O X O . . . . . X . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . O O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , O . . . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . B . . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
I suppose it's important to put that pressure on, early.

AI 2

Here, and in the following several moves:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X O . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . O X O . . . . . X . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . X . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . O O O . O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . . X X O O X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X . . O X X O O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O X X . X . . X O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O X . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . O . O X O X . . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ | O X X O X X . X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
The AI suggests that I can be ahead if I move out the cutting stone:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X O . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . O X O . . . . . X . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . X . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . O O O . O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . . X X O O X B . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X . . O X X O O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | X O X X . X . . X O . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O O O O O X . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . O . O X O X . . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ | O X X O X X . X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
I felt the result was bad for black because of white's influence there. But I suppose the point is, white's influence isn't perfect. If I move out the black stones there, I can negate white's influence in the center.
be immersed
User avatar
Knotwilg
Oza
Posts: 2432
Joined: Fri Jan 14, 2011 6:53 am
Rank: KGS 2d OGS 1d Fox 4d
GD Posts: 0
KGS: Artevelde
OGS: Knotwilg
Online playing schedule: UTC 18:00 - 22:00
Location: Ghent, Belgium
Has thanked: 360 times
Been thanked: 1021 times
Contact:

Re: Kirby's Study Journal

Post by Knotwilg »

In this position:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X O . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . O X O . . . . . X . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | X . X d . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . X . . c . . . . . . . . . e X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . a . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . O O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , O . . . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . O . . b . . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Neither A nor B would occur to me, for different reasons. I would definitely feel the urge to play with the ponnuki, preventing C, either by playing C myself or D. Therefore I would not consider B because of the apparent urgency of the area. A is a move that goes along well with the 3 black stones below, almost a middle game joseki move, but it's cursing against the power of the ponnuki.

With hindsight, I can see that C is not a very efficient move for either Black or White. Black's ponnuki is too resilient for White to attack swiftly, while building influence towards no man's land. And White's three stones are out in the center, even after Black C.

So I think I understand why AI favors B, which is a rather severe approach to White's corner, while taking a wide stake at the bottom. Probably being a ladder breaker (ladder starting with E) is another added value.
Kirby
Honinbo
Posts: 9553
Joined: Wed Feb 24, 2010 6:04 pm
GD Posts: 0
KGS: Kirby
Tygem: 커비라고해
Has thanked: 1583 times
Been thanked: 1707 times

Re: Kirby's Study Journal

Post by Kirby »

I think you have a good point that 'a' makes the ponnuki a bit inefficient.
be immersed
User avatar
Magicwand
Tengen
Posts: 4844
Joined: Wed Apr 21, 2010 5:26 am
Rank: Wbaduk 7D
GD Posts: 0
KGS: magicwand
Tygem: magicwand
Wbaduk: rlatkfkd
DGS: magicwand
OGS: magicwand
Location: Mechanicsburg, PA
Has thanked: 62 times
Been thanked: 504 times

Re: Kirby's Study Journal

Post by Magicwand »

e has some issues. You will lose points if u play e
"The more we think we know about
The greater the unknown"

Words by neil peart, music by geddy lee and alex lifeson
Post Reply