Prokovich game
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Chew Terr
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Re: Prokovich game
W has to do something to stop the cut at G12 (the cut above seems less important, since sacrificing those two stones helps). Either white can connect directly, or try to get it in sente, possibly by pushing again like this. If white pushes again, I expect something to finally attain stability, like grabbing eyespace with an extension or maybe cutting at 'a'.
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gaius
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Re: Prokovich game
Wowzers, this is ugly by black... White is solidified quite a lot. Maybe this now? I also considered black 'a' but white has solidified so much that I'm becoming afraid of the invasion at 71 :shock. After this 'a' black is probably behind in points, but white's group is still under some pressure, so he probably has to spend another move defending it and then maybe black 'b' or 'c' could make the game close again?
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When in doubt, play the most aggressive move
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Joaz Banbeck
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Re: Prokovich game
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Chew Terr
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Re: Prokovich game
Joaz Banbeck wrote:H12 is dual sente and big.
Oh duh, I saw that it was huge, but somehow missed the threat that makes it so sente. Yeah, definitely expecting this, now.
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Magicwand
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Re: Prokovich game
71 is solid but it is giving white point 'a' that is too ideal.
for that reason i will play at 71 if i had to play there.
going high is also an option
71 below is slow but it is well worth one move and i like this move.
i think this is the best move i can comeup with.
for that reason i will play at 71 if i had to play there.
going high is also an option
71 below is slow but it is well worth one move and i like this move.
i think this is the best move i can comeup with.
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gaius
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Re: Prokovich game
Magicwand wrote:71 is solid but it is giving white point 'a' that is too ideal.
Is that really so? While thinking about this position, the three-point extension was actually the one that I discarded first... It leaves behind a glaring invasion point which you'll probably have to defend at some point, and white still has a good shape point left at this 'a' (not that he'd necessarily have to play there immediately). I personally like 'c', but if I would want to put more pressure on white, I would play 'b' instead, as that doesn't give white any good shape point. I might be wrong, but to me, your move feels a bit like an "in-between" move that only half accomplishes two goals...
'd' also feels good; even though I would personally be afraid that it's just a notch too slow, it might very well be the best move.
My name is Gijs, from Utrecht, NL.
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When in doubt, play the most aggressive move
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gaius
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Re: Prokovich game
Joaz Banbeck wrote:H12 is dual sente and big.
It's double sente for sure. So the question is whether this:
is really better for black than this (71 added for reference and because I like it):
I think I slightly prefer the second diagramme for black, so I would not feel the need to make this exchange now. It's subtle though...
EDIT: looking at it again, the black hane at 'a' might even be better than this
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Magicwand
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Re: Prokovich game
gaius wrote:Joaz Banbeck wrote:H12 is dual sente and big.
It's double sente for sure. So the question is whether this:
is really better for black than this (71 added for reference and because I like it):
I think I slightly prefer the second diagramme for black, so I would not feel the need to make this exchange now. It's subtle though...
EDIT: looking at it again, the black hane at 'a' might even be better than this
your first diagram only helps white.
your second diagram only helps black.
in my opinion both move sucks. let's observe who will play sucky move first
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xed_over
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Re: Prokovich game
dfan wrote: ACTUAL GAME: Move 71.
that seemed unexpected
edit: though there was some earlier discussion of that move between moves 35-40ish.
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Joaz Banbeck
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Re: Prokovich game
To figure out why black played that, I think Gaius has the right direction.
I think that Gaius is right: it is a good move and it is too slow.
Note that white probably has to respond, else black will play like this, in sente:
So white will respond like this:
...and while black gets a good grip on the center, it is aji keshi: it forces white to become strong.
So black adds one more to the sacrifice stones, keeping the aji of the isolated white stones, knowing that sooner or later white will have to fill some of his own territory to kill the black stones.
Now white does not have an easy answer.
If he tries to answer by eliminating the problem at 'a', he dies.
He can play solid but passive, and black gets 73, with all the bad aji at 'a' in the offing.
BTW, this last diagram is my prediction.
gaius wrote:'d' also feels good; even though I would personally be afraid that it's just a notch too slow, it might very well be the best move.
I think that Gaius is right: it is a good move and it is too slow.
Note that white probably has to respond, else black will play like this, in sente:
So white will respond like this:
...and while black gets a good grip on the center, it is aji keshi: it forces white to become strong.
So black adds one more to the sacrifice stones, keeping the aji of the isolated white stones, knowing that sooner or later white will have to fill some of his own territory to kill the black stones.
Now white does not have an easy answer.
If he tries to answer by eliminating the problem at 'a', he dies.
He can play solid but passive, and black gets 73, with all the bad aji at 'a' in the offing.
BTW, this last diagram is my prediction.
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Re: Prokovich game
Metagame analysis: If Joaz had correctly guessed a few moves in a row, I think Dfan would have shown them all. So I'm guessing the next move is wrong.
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