Dankovitch I: Shaddy vs. dts

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hyperpape
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Re: Dankovitch I: Shaddy vs. dts

Post by hyperpape »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm27 Black 27
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X . . O . X . O . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . O 8 6 O . . . X . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . O X 4 3 1 . . . . . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . O X 7 5 2 . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Seems bad, right? White has split Black's corner from his center. Maybe there's not much aji on the outside, but I just don't think that those outside stones are worth enough to make this good.
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Chew Terr
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Re: Dankovitch I: Shaddy vs. dts

Post by Chew Terr »

hyperpape wrote:Seems bad, right? White has split Black's corner from his center. Maybe there's not much aji on the outside, but I just don't think that those outside stones are worth enough to make this good.


That really comes down to how much black can harass the top right white group. If black can chase or kill them, he can sacrifice the top left stones in good conscience and be content. If he only gets a partial success in the top right, he can save his top left stones and be fine. I'm not certain or anything, but it doesn't seem like the cut is bad for sure, just a much more influential choice.
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Re: Dankovitch I: Shaddy vs. dts

Post by daniel_the_smith »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm27 Black 27
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X . . O . X . O . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . O 3 . O . . . X . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . O X . . 1 . . . . . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . O X . . 2 . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Sano & everyone else: I didn't think it was acceptable to let those three stones get cut off.

Now that I look again, though, I think a solid connection is better than this move.
That which can be destroyed by the truth should be.
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Re: Dankovitch I: Shaddy vs. dts

Post by Sano »

White's move seems obvious now, of course...

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm30
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X . . O . X . O . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . O X . O . . . X . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . 1 O X . . X . . . . . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . O X . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Also, after that I still think Black would cut at G15 - but maybe Black at G18 or H18 would be good, too?
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Re: Dankovitch I: Shaddy vs. dts

Post by Shaddy »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm27 Black 27
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X . . O . X . O . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . O 3 . O . . . X . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . O X . . 1 . . . . . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . O X . . 2 4 . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


the few points on the side can be sacrificed. these stones cannot.
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Re: Dankovitch I: Shaddy vs. dts

Post by daniel_the_smith »

Just to be clear, Shaddy's last diagram is what happened in the game.
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Re: Dankovitch I: Shaddy vs. dts

Post by daniel_the_smith »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm31 Black 31
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X . . O . X . O . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . O X . O . . . X . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . O X . . X 1 . . . . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . O X . . O O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I was 3-2 at a tournament on Saturday. Apparently I really am 2d AGA. So weird; I spent over a year each as a 2k and a 1k and only a few months as a 1d... The worst thing is I don't know what I know now that I didn't know then... :/
That which can be destroyed by the truth should be.
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Re: Dankovitch I: Shaddy vs. dts

Post by Sano »

Does white connect at f15 now?
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Re: Dankovitch I: Shaddy vs. dts

Post by daniel_the_smith »

Close.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm31 Black 31
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X . . O . X . O . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . O X . O . . . X . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . O X . 2 X X . . . . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . O X . . O O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
That which can be destroyed by the truth should be.
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hyperpape
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Re: Dankovitch I: Shaddy vs. dts

Post by hyperpape »

I started to say that C15 is obvious, but I think that Black can play K13 and deal with the bad shape if white connects at C15.
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Re: Dankovitch I: Shaddy vs. dts

Post by daniel_the_smith »

Got it in one.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm31 Black 33
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X . . O . X . O . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . O X . O . . . X . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . O X . O X X . . . . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . O X . . O O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . 3 . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
That which can be destroyed by the truth should be.
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Chew Terr
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Re: Dankovitch I: Shaddy vs. dts

Post by Chew Terr »

W jumps, like to G11? Seems like W doesn't want a weak group on both sides, and this side seems more urgent.
Someday I want to be strong enough to earn KGS[-].
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Re: Dankovitch I: Shaddy vs. dts

Post by Shaddy »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm31 Black 33
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X . . O . X . O . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . O X . O . . . X . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . 4 O X . O X X . . . . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . O X . . O O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . 3 . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


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