I think I've seen this somewhere on here before, but can't find it.
I've had this position happen in my game, and I'm not quite sure how to handle it.
I answered at a, but I now think that b is better. white may be able to connect under, but black can keep white low and short of eyes. Is this correct? or is there a better way to handle this?
a little help with this position
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Bill Spight
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Re: a little help with this position
dedroid wrote:I think I've seen this somewhere on here before, but can't find it.
I've had this position happen in my game, and I'm not quite sure how to handle it.
I answered at a, but I now think that b is better. white may be able to connect under, but black can keep white low and short of eyes. Is this correct? or is there a better way to handle this?
"a" gives up too much. "b" does not threaten to separate the White stones.
I like
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cyclops
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Re: a little help with this position
lorill wrote:how do you continue if white pushes ?
s10 I would answer with b@s7 and keep w seperated.
r9 I would answer with b@q8.
I think I am so I think I am.
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logan
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Re: a little help with this position
B is the proper way to respond, A is the incorrect. There is a full analysis of this position in 100 Tips for Amateur Players II by Yoon Youngsun.
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Joaz Banbeck
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Re: a little help with this position
Or maybe 'a' first. But white will live inside of black's area of influence.
Small, small, small, small, small.
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Gresil
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Re: a little help with this position
I would cap it with a keima. Is that too mellow?
So you've got an eye?
That don't impress me much
That don't impress me much
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amnal
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Re: a little help with this position
Gresil wrote:I would cap it with a keima. Is that too mellow?
Seems basically the same as R10 but unnecessarily...well, yes, mellow. Since you can block white strongly with R10 without problems, there's no need to play R11.
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SoDesuNe
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Re: a little help with this position
Joaz Banbeck wrote:
Or maybe 'a' first. But white will live inside of black's area of influence.
Small, small, small, small, small.
Hm, whole bottom right, massive thickness into the center and White lives small and is sealed. I don't see a big loss for Black.
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oren
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Re: a little help with this position
dedroid wrote:so many different responses O-O now i are confused
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Magicwand
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Re: a little help with this position
will result in 
which is a bad play for black.if black can not catch this group he will lose too much.
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Bartleby
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Re: a little help with this position
logan wrote:B is the proper way to respond, A is the incorrect. There is a full analysis of this position in 100 Tips for Amateur Players II by Yoon Youngsun.
If you are talking about the analysis on p. 163, I think there may be a difference here, which is that here there are other white stones near enough to be helpful in some lines.
I remember asking a similar question about an invasion on the second line directly under a stone on the middle starpoint in a san ren sei opening. I am not sure whether that was on Go Discussions or here.
In that situation, like in the example 100 Tips for Amateur Players II, there were no friendly stones around (i.e., it was an invasion of one stone on the second line beneath a stone on the fourth line). Someone (maybe Bill Spight or Araban?) suggested that the normal response was to play a butting move against the invading stone, but that it depended to some extent on the surrounding stones.
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Dusk Eagle
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Re: a little help with this position
I think the butting move is good if the stones are a line farther back. There's a noticeable difference between these two positions:
So far, I think Bill's suggestion for this situation is best:
If it seems unsatisfying, that might be because in the top right corner, the exchange of
for 
is much better for white than for black. When white plays 
below, black should hane:
So far, I think Bill's suggestion for this situation is best:
If it seems unsatisfying, that might be because in the top right corner, the exchange of
for is much better for white than for black. When white plays below, black should hane:We don't know who we are; we don't know where we are.
Each of us woke up one moment and here we were in the darkness.
We're nameless things with no memory; no knowledge of what went before,
No understanding of what is now, no knowledge of what will be.
Each of us woke up one moment and here we were in the darkness.
We're nameless things with no memory; no knowledge of what went before,
No understanding of what is now, no knowledge of what will be.