Starcraft II

[topazg]

But what good is playing more games, when I'm not going to get any better?

Have you asked yourself whether being better has to be the point or not?

I've spent most of my pre-21 life as an avid gamer, from roguelikes to strategies to FPS to RPGs, and I liked the fact that I was pretty good at any of them I turned my hand to. However, I've always been lazy, and no matter how good I got at anything, there were always people out there better. I don't mean I could only win head to head 40% of the time, I mean _really_ better, like beat me 99% of the time. These people had the natural skillsets (hand-eye co-ord, reflexes, quick thinking under pressure) the learned skillsets (mouse sensitivity attunement, how to hide, shortcut keys) and dedicated X hours a day to getting really damn good.

I started asking myself "why do I want to compete with these people?". The only answer I had was "to be better than them", but then there are more people out there even better again, and eventually that target is the IQ 160 sporty mental gymnast that has dedicated 10 hours a day to _that specific game_ for the last 8 years, and you reach that point where you realise you will never be better. If your only goal is to be better than the people you are up against until there's no-one left to beat, you will fail, you will be frustrated, and you will keep returning to "what's the point". I've realised that, for me personally, trying to constantly win and overtake my opposition is frustrating, and ultimately pointless. If I was the world's best Civ V player, or WoW Warlock, or whatever (excluding professionally played FPS and RTS games), no-one that I really care about would be very interested. I would have offered nothing productive to society other than being good at a video game, and my personal pride in my achievement would be tainted by that constant question "so what?".

So, I play to enjoy games. Sometimes I win, sometimes I lose. Sometimes I play to learn, and find learning enjoyable too. Go fits in for me because it's good brain exercise, it's social, it teaches me to approach anything I think I know with the attitude of "Ok, maybe I don't know" - and this reflects positively on the rest of my life - and, for the most part, it is relaxing. I play the MMO Lord of the Rings Online sometimes when I can squeeze in some time, and that's nice too. It's relaxing, I play with a few online friends and we chat about babies and work and the latest news, or maybe crack bad puns for cheap laughs, and I leave feeling that I had fun. I don't particularly care that my main character is still only level 33 and I may never hit the level cap, because I don't play to grind my way to the top for 1337 skillz pride. If the game didn't help me relax, or I didn't enjoy chatting to the people I know on there, I'd do something else. I'm pretty good with numbers, patterns, and logic, and I could write a spreadsheet that enables me to fine-tune my DPS / against damage received and be 5-10% more effective within the game, but again I'm left with the feeling that it's all rather pointless, so I don't, I just enjoy playing instead.

If you want to be a professional gamer, you have the right attitude. Play, sweat, bleed the game until you are _really_ good. If that's how you want to earn your living, go do it, you'll provide a bunch of other people with entertainment making it reasonably valuable societally, and you can put bread on the table doing things you have a natural aptitude and desire to do - a dream most people never achieve. If you don't want to be one, or think you can't be one, maybe stop expecting so much of yourself? Play to enjoy, or do something else to enjoy?

[Solomon]

CSamurai: have you seen this? http://day9tv.blip.tv/file/4712303/ - I think you might find it incredibly helpful (as it did for me).

[MountainGo]

CSamurai: have you seen this? http://day9tv.blip.tv/file/4712303/ - I think you might find it incredibly helpful (as it did for me).

I watched that yesterday and definitely found it insightful on many points, such as using your actions efficiently rather than spamming to increase your APM. I HATE it when streamers click over and over on the same point! I want to tell them that they are achieving the exact opposite of what they want. They're trying to be fast, but by issuing the same order repeatedly, you're actually spending MORE time on that one action. For me, though, I realized that I scroll around too often. I already use four camera hotkeys, but I think I might start using more of them.

His only dubious point was his insistence on clicking directly on individual units/structures instead of boxing them. Ironically, he consistently used boxes for everything even in that video, except when specifically demonstrating not to. That's because it's easier and faster. There are definitely cases when you have to click, specifically when many things are bunched together. It seemed like he might be saying to train yourself to ALWAYS click so that you're confident, quick and accurate when it becomes necessary. But I'm not convinced it's worth it.

[Numsgil]

I'm surprised he never mentioned double clicking on units to select all of that type. That's what I use a LOT. I'll go so far as to scroll the screen so I can only see the units I want selected (eg: scroll away from the mineral line to select the idle workers) and then double click the unit. Obviously that specific example is bad. Not sure if it makes sense at other times. I can't be the only one that does that.

[ketchup]

I watched that yesterday and definitely found it insightful on many points, such as using your actions efficiently rather than spamming to increase your APM. I HATE it when streamers click over and over on the same point! I want to tell them that they are achieving the exact opposite of what they want. They're trying to be fast, but by issuing the same order repeatedly, you're actually spending MORE time on that one action

So, I'm pretty sure many of them do that tidbit, partly out of habit, and partly to warm up for later. I think the idea is that you'll gradually hit a good speed/balance in terms of apm and what's needed. And when it comes time to go crazy marine spread micro, they won't be caught off guard because their hands aren't warmed up.

As an example, just try to type something after waking up, and compare it to typing after typing out a multiple page paper. There's a pretty big difference in terms of fluidity of your fingers on the keyboard.

Also a funny glitch/bug/crash/whatever for you zergs:

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmes ... _id=190208

[CSamurai]

CSamurai: have you seen this? http://day9tv.blip.tv/file/4712303/ - I think you might find it incredibly helpful (as it did for me).

I watched it. Much of it is things I try to do. I need to work on my hot key use, and I didn't know about the f5-9 screen hot keys, and I'm trying to work in that stuff. I've never been one to artificially enhance my APM. At most, if I'm relaxed, I'll play around in the first few minutes while there's a lot of empty time where everything's mining and building.

It's interesting though, seeing some of the stuff I was trying to do just because I felt like it was faster being advised. I use the mini map a lot. Heck, I scout using the mini map to move my probe/observer around, rather than clicking all the way down there. If you get good, you can know which of your buildings is where, and chrono it from the mini map. The couple of times I've played zerg, I've hot keyed my queens and spit larva using the mini map. It always frustrated me that I can't warp in units using the mini map, I actually have to click on a pylon somewhere and warp them in. Bleh.

This actually makes Protoss slightly harder to macro than say, anything else, because you have to keep switching attention back to your nearest pylon to reinforce a fight, wheras you can hotkey your production buildings, and set them to rally near the fight and just keep spewing units with them.

Protoss are the only ones who have to continually shift focus back and forth like that.

I tried to play a little terran yesterday. Did a little yabot, tried a few builds, went and played online, and got myself stomped 6 times out of 6, decided I could do that with protoss, and went back to it.
As for Topaz's comments..

I.. really should stop. Really. My frustration level is high, the return is low, and I don't even enjoy the games that I'm winning these days. I feel mean when I win, stupid when I lose, and all around silly no matter what happens.

But...

I can't. When I close my eyes my last game is there behind my eyelids. I see my build errors, or where I could have microed this better, or where I could have tried that. I see where I need to tech up and build more, and I see where I should have defended more before pushing. I see.. frustratins, points I'm pleased with, replaying over and over in my skull. I try to distract myself, but at work, I find myself thinking about SC2.

When I'm at home, when a tv show hits commercial, I think about sc2. When I'm chatting with my friends online, and things get quiet.. sc2.

It's in my head and under my skin and I am not very good at ignoring it. I always have some obsession. For a while that was go. I had the same sort of crazy drive, always had to improve, felt like crap if I didn't (which is a problem since I've been solid 5k for 2 years now.) I thought about it when I went to bed, in the shower in the morning, and while I was at work, I played games on IGS on my breaks.

In a year or two, I'll be on something else, though go won't ever fully fade, and may be that something else. Maybe then I can quit sc2.

Right now, I just can't get it out of my brain.

[Aphelion]

CSamurai, up for a few games on bnet? I'm Aphelion.831, lets take a look at some things that are troubling you

[CSamurai]

Sorry, was taking a computer vacation for most of the day, hanging out with real life friends. Good to remind myself that this stuff, ultimately, is just something I do to fill the time.

Managed to get on late tonight, and have added you to my list. Hope to catch you around, I never mind playing/trying to work on things.

[xinwen]

wow.. is this thread still active i have just started starcraft 2 recently.. but i'm in SEA server most of the time

hello guys~~~

i'm xinwen.168

i'm also xinwen in kgs~~

[CSamurai]

Welcome, and welcome to the forum!

Unfortunately, msot of the active posters on this thread are in the EU or NA servers, but we love chatting about SC2 regardless.

Nice to meet you.

[fwiffo]

I seem to be much more serious about my Starcraft spectating than playing... Has anyone else been watching the GSTL? How epic was that final?

[Chew Terr]

I seem to be much more serious about my Starcraft spectating than playing... Has anyone else been watching the GSTL? How epic was that final?

Haven't gotten to see it, though I love the idea of team tournaments. I've only seen the first two and a half matchups, but so far, my favorite team has lost/started losing every time. Ouch!

[Solomon]

I seem to be much more serious about my Starcraft spectating than playing... Has anyone else been watching the GSTL? How epic was that final?

Game 8 was, hands down, the greatest game of SC2 ever played so far. Maps make a HUGE difference.

[yoyoma]

Stop whatever you are doing, paypal GomTV $5, and watch the GSTL finals NAOW!!

/dance

[fwiffo]

The previous rounds had some of the best games I've ever seen too (ST_Ace and IMSeed had some amazing games); they pale only in comparison to the finals (and yes, GAME 8!!!!). You get quite a lot for the $5. Good matches for all the races too (no zergs in the earlier rounds, but some nice matches from July in the semis and finals).