Simba
Lives with ko
Posts: 170 Joined: Wed Feb 16, 2011 8:54 amRank: 6d KGSGD Posts: 0Has thanked: 14 times Been thanked: 23 times
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by Simba Thu Apr 21, 2011 8:06 pm
$$Bcm1 Move 1 - B:9(4) W:9(3)
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Bcm1 Move 1 - B:9(4) W:9(3)
topazg
Tengen
Posts: 4511 Joined: Wed Apr 21, 2010 3:08 amRank: NebulousGD Posts: 918KGS: topazgLocation: Chatteris, UKHas thanked: 1579 times Been thanked: 650 times
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by topazg Fri Apr 22, 2011 3:44 am
Approved
Mnemonic
Lives in gote
Posts: 324 Joined: Wed Aug 11, 2010 10:41 pmRank: KGS 7 kyuGD Posts: 0KGS: Mnemonic, dude13Location: DresdenHas thanked: 26 times Been thanked: 22 times
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by Mnemonic Fri Apr 22, 2011 11:19 am
$$Bcm1 Move 10 - B:9(4) W:9(4)
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Bcm1 Move 10 - B:9(4) W:9(4)
First decision of the game. Our stone on the left is a bit cramped but I don't see a good way of saving him. The 2 space extension n would be undercut and black's group is too strong to be really pressured by jumping out. If black plays there first I might try something like this.
$$Bcm1 Black is solid but over concentrated
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Bcm1 Black is solid but over concentratedSo the question is do I settle the upper side or do I tenuki (approach the upper right star point) I'm more in favor of tenukiing since the board is so open and I don't like leaving black with sente. If we play the standard joseki the gap between the marked stones is too small to be interesting yet:
$$Bcm1 upper side pretty much settled
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Bcm1 upper side pretty much settledAnd if they pincer we fight!
While I was teaching the game to a friend of mine, my mother from the other room:
Aphelion
Lives in sente
Posts: 766 Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2010 12:14 pmRank: KGS 4 kyuGD Posts: 227KGS: Aphelion02Has thanked: 24 times Been thanked: 59 times
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by Aphelion Wed Apr 27, 2011 7:19 pm
$$Bcm1 Move 10 - B:9(4) W:9(4)
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Bcm1 Move 10 - B:9(4) W:9(4)This move is too thin. With the marked stone so weak; it is even more of a priority to ensure that the top group is completely solid, or the multiple weaknesses could become a pretty big liability. As black I probably would consider pincering or playing directly at b.
Simba
Lives with ko
Posts: 170 Joined: Wed Feb 16, 2011 8:54 amRank: 6d KGSGD Posts: 0Has thanked: 14 times Been thanked: 23 times
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by Simba Thu Apr 28, 2011 2:48 am
$$Bcm11 Move 10 - B:10(0) W:10(0)
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Bcm11 Move 10 - B:10(0) W:10(0)
Other option:
$$Bcm11 Move 10 - B:10(0) W:10(0)
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Bcm11 Move 10 - B:10(0) W:10(0)I considered this two-space low pincer to hopefully get a base for the pincer stone and simultaneously attack the group at the top left with a follow up on H17, but I don't see how to respond to white playing L16 in a good way. If I hane outside then connect, I'm going to have to do it in gote and then that group would come under immediate attack - not good.
As for the move I want to play:
$$Bcm11 Move 10 - B:10(0) W:10(0)
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Bcm11 Move 10 - B:10(0) W:10(0)or:
$$Bcm11 Move 10 - B:10(0) W:10(0)
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Bcm11 Move 10 - B:10(0) W:10(0)This kind of thing anyway. Hopefully I'm not screwing up too badly
...
topazg
Tengen
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by topazg Tue May 03, 2011 2:30 am
Mnemonic
Lives in gote
Posts: 324 Joined: Wed Aug 11, 2010 10:41 pmRank: KGS 7 kyuGD Posts: 0KGS: Mnemonic, dude13Location: DresdenHas thanked: 26 times Been thanked: 22 times
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by Mnemonic Tue May 03, 2011 11:44 am
$$Bcm11 Move 12 - B:10(1) W:10(0)
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Bcm11 Move 12 - B:10(1) W:10(0)
While I was teaching the game to a friend of mine, my mother from the other room:
Simba
Lives with ko
Posts: 170 Joined: Wed Feb 16, 2011 8:54 amRank: 6d KGSGD Posts: 0Has thanked: 14 times Been thanked: 23 times
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by Simba Sat May 07, 2011 6:15 pm
Sorry everyone for being slow - tons of work to do lately as my final exams are coming up, they're done in about 4 weeks, so after then I'll be able to speed up a lot
.
$$Bcm13 Move 13 - B:10(1) W:10(1)
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Bcm13 Move 13 - B:10(1) W:10(1)
Okay. I've read D9 and D10 for half an hour each or so, and it seems white can definitely live if we play D9, and possibly lives if we play D10 too (jump to B10 lives?!) So, I'm going to play it safe and play this point to ensure white can't do any funny business and live. White probably needs 2 more moves the kill the top right, and even if he does, the territory along the left (along with the influence pointing towards the right and down) is probably worth more. Sorry if this is too small and D9/D10 are better as I realise in this game every single point will count, but I do think this is a more secure move (and one I'm more comfortable with).
Our other reasonable alternative is C9. This doesn't kill (assuming I've read this right - another 20 minutes or so!), but if white chooses to live, we get a big wall with a ton of thickness. However, the net territory swing is probably 20-30 points, and in this variation (C10) we get amount of influence also. We don't have to worry about aji problems with the stone living later too if the potential thickness pointing towards the right became compromised in its usefulness. Is the extra thickness from the C9 variation worth 20-30 points? Probably not considering we already have some decent thickness from this variation... And with the aji problems, I prefer C10...
Hopefully I won't get shouted at
...
Aphelion
Lives in sente
Posts: 766 Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2010 12:14 pmRank: KGS 4 kyuGD Posts: 227KGS: Aphelion02Has thanked: 24 times Been thanked: 59 times
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by Aphelion Sat May 07, 2011 7:13 pm
topazg
Tengen
Posts: 4511 Joined: Wed Apr 21, 2010 3:08 amRank: NebulousGD Posts: 918KGS: topazgLocation: Chatteris, UKHas thanked: 1579 times Been thanked: 650 times
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by topazg Sun May 08, 2011 1:57 pm
Rejected!
$$Bcm13 Move 13 - B:9(0) W:10(1)
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Bcm13 Move 13 - B:9(0) W:10(1)
In some way it's frustrating to have a sente move made non-sente by a tenuki, and the double approach is pretty big. On the other hand, White still has to find a way of handling the left side, and the top right temperature has now risen pretty high. It will be interesting to see where the dust settles. One thing I don't think we could allow is this:
$$Bcm13 Move 13 - B:10(1) W:10(1)
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Bcm13 Move 13 - B:10(1) W:10(1)Now the marked White stones (and
) all work wonderfully together. I had wondered about resetting to one of the "a" points as well, as that looks fairly interesting due to White's weaknesses generally (and my correcting here will thicken white up wrt the top side), but I think standard joseki works better in a BB game where corrections are limited. We'll see what MHT does
Mnemonic
Lives in gote
Posts: 324 Joined: Wed Aug 11, 2010 10:41 pmRank: KGS 7 kyuGD Posts: 0KGS: Mnemonic, dude13Location: DresdenHas thanked: 26 times Been thanked: 22 times
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by Mnemonic Sun May 08, 2011 3:46 pm
$$Bcm13 Move 14 - B:9(0) W:10(1)
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Bcm13 Move 14 - B:9(0) W:10(1)Yay, first correction!
And it's not my fault. I shouldn't be too happy as I know I messed up the joseki in the top left
Anywho, the response to this move came natural. I'm still a bit worried about a pincer on our top left group seeing as black is so strong, and this move helps, even if it's far away.
While I was teaching the game to a friend of mine, my mother from the other room:
Simba
Lives with ko
Posts: 170 Joined: Wed Feb 16, 2011 8:54 amRank: 6d KGSGD Posts: 0Has thanked: 14 times Been thanked: 23 times
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by Simba Fri May 13, 2011 2:11 am
$$Bcm13 Move 14 - B:9(0) W:10(2)
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Bcm13 Move 14 - B:9(0) W:10(2)
Still don't think my last move was that bad, but ah well. This one is completely standard. I really don't like this though - white is going to end up with some stones from this joseki that point towards the left and work nicely with what he has in the top left already. Sure, if I sacrificed the corner (which white would likely need two more moves to fully kill) he'd get that too, but at least then we'd have all the left, and I'd get to play somewhere else as well. I'd be hoping to end this joseki in sente then play C10 again but if topaz is not happy with C10, there's not really any point wasting /another/ correction to try to play it
. I considered the P17 joseki here too but white just gets too much nice stuff pointing towards the left again.
...
...
) all work wonderfully together. I had wondered about resetting to one of the "a" points as well, as that looks fairly interesting due to White's weaknesses generally (and my correcting here will thicken white up wrt the top side), but I think standard joseki works better in a BB game where corrections are limited. We'll see what MHT does 