14k v 16k

[Boyce]

Hey guys!
This is a game I played earlier today on KGS. It seemed to go pretty well although I know I made quite a few mistakes (as in alot I'm sure... ). During this game and several others I have had, the person always seems to start pushing, or "digging" into my territory-its around move 60 this game. I have no idea how to stop them though. I try to get in front but they always seem to catch those stones or just start pushing in a different direction. I was wondering if anyone had any tips to stopping that. I was so concerned with stopping it I kind of lost a whole group on the right side of the board. Also feel free to point out anything else. Thanks in advance- I really appreciate any advice!



Boyce

[SpongeBob]

Move 52 is too slow. Instead, you can attack the three white stones.

The same holds for 54.

Move 60, you can play at H11, as you do not need to fear any cuts here.

Also 66 can be played faster, e.g. at F13. Remember this keima (two steps forward and one step to the side), it is a fast and relatively secure attacking move that is often useful.

The same holds for 68.

With 76 you tried to kill. If you just play at M11, he cannot go into your territory and you have secured it. Should be enough to win, I guess.

This is often the danger if you try to kill by all means. If you do not succeed, your opponent gets the chance to counter attack. This happens here where while attacking, you are weakening your own position and in the end it is not your opponent who dies, but you. This is something which I am also still having problems with.

[jts]

176: You almost always want to play r4 in situations like this (he has the 4-4 point, you invade the 3-3 point). If he takes r4, you take q3. You can play around with the stones to try to figure out what people normally play next, and what would have been appropriate here. -- And also you might ask yourself, how would you respond to W183 at s1?

About the game in general, and about white "digging into your territory":

Your first ten moves were good and your opponent's were very poor, but you shouldn't let that deceive you. You seem to think that from move 14 to move 43, you and your opponent divided the board in two, so that rows 1-6 are "his territory" and rows 7-19 are "your territory". On the contrary! You have given him 6th line territory in exchange for a 7th line wall which will influence fighting in the center. In general, this is very bad; even a 5th line wall (facing the center) in exchange for 4th line territory (on the side) is usually considered to be favorable for the territorial player.

But lo! Your opponent starts trying to make a living group with the K10 stone, right next to your wall. You think that he has successfully "dug into" your territory, and are afraid that this invasion will be a "success"; but that's misleading. It wasn't your territory to begin with, it was an area where you had lots of influence, and you should have been overjoyed that White wanted to start a contact fight there, of all places, where the fight benefits you the most. White made a huge mistake, and this was the only that you could take such a high wall and make a profit out of it. Look at all the territory that you built up while he was floundering around with the weak K10 group; the entire left side, the entire top side.

In general, your 8-stone wall on the seventh line would yield maybe 24 points (people estimate 2-3 points per stone), while his 8-stone wall on the sixth line would yield 40 points. But because he immediately tried to start a fight in your zone of influence, you turned the wall into about 80 points.

[EdLee]

A few ideas. Study the broken shape:

[Boyce]

Thank you for all the replies! It appears that I need to be way less greedy concerning center facing walls (although I need to play more territorially I've been told as well). I guess after seeing the walls build up in the first few moves I saw territory being built, and got concerned when white pushed through. I also need to understand when I can move quickly it seems, but I worry about getting cut in two all the time . I had decided before I started playing that I would focus on staying connected and dividing his pieces since I need work on it, but as EdLee pointed out I was letting my pieces get divided quite often.

As to the W183@S1, in the corner I was fairly sure I was dead. I realized my mistake after I didn't move to R4. Had he moved to S1, I would have had to move at R1, then he could have killed at T4. I don't see anyway to live-I was fortunate he made a mistake as well.

About contact fights in areas of influence, I felt like I was building a moyo in the center that game which I thought meant making territory. From what you said the point of a moyo like that would be to invite the person inside hopefully and then make territory from attacking them?

Thanks again for the advice and reviews!

Boyce

[EdLee]

I was letting my pieces get divided quite often.

Boyce, stones can be divided/separated/split in different ways. For example:

$$B Cross-cut
$$ . . . . . . . .
$$ . . . . . . . .
$$ . . . X O . . .
$$ . . . O X . . .
$$ . . . . . . . .
$$ . . . . . . . .

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$B Cross-cut
$$ . . . . . . . .
$$ . . . . . . . .
$$ . . . X O . . .
$$ . . . O X . . .
$$ . . . . . . . .
$$ . . . . . . . .[/go]

$$B Start of joseki
$$ | . . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . . 4 . . . .
$$ | . . 1 , . . . . .
$$ | . . . . 2 . 3 . .
$$ | . . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . . . . . . .
$$ -------------------

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$B Start of joseki
$$ | . . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . . 4 . . . .
$$ | . . 1 , . . . . .
$$ | . . . . 2 . 3 . .
$$ | . . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . . . . . . .
$$ -------------------[/go]

$$B Start of joseki
$$ | . . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . . . 4 . . .
$$ | . . 1 , 2 . . . .
$$ | . . . . . . 3 . .
$$ | . . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . . . . . . .
$$ -------------------

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$B Start of joseki
$$ | . . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . . . 4 . . .
$$ | . . 1 , 2 . . . .
$$ | . . . . . . 3 . .
$$ | . . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . . . . . . .
$$ -------------------[/go]

But the particular kinds to study in your shapes are these and their variations, which are fundamentally different from the above:

$$B Broken shapes for :black:
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
$$ . . . O . . . . . . O . . .
$$ . . . O X . . . . X O X . .
$$ . . X O . . . . . . O . . .
$$ . . . O . . . . . . . . . .
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . . . .

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$B Broken shapes for :black:
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
$$ . . . O . . . . . . O . . .
$$ . . . O X . . . . X O X . .
$$ . . X O . . . . . . O . . .
$$ . . . O . . . . . . . . . .
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . . . .[/go]

See also:
http://senseis.xmp.net/?SqueezingOutTheToothpaste
http://senseis.xmp.net/?SmallGaps
http://senseis.xmp.net/?LameDuGo

[Boyce]

Those articles and your advice on broken shape were very helpful! I played another game earlier today trying to keep in mind to not let my positions become broken shape and I feel like I did a much better job at it. I'm still having problems of telling when I can move quicker vs a slower move, but thats probably going to take me awhile to work on. Just wanted to say I feel like all the advice you guys gave was very helpful

Boyce

[Redundant]

Those articles and your advice on broken shape were very helpful! I played another game earlier today trying to keep in mind to not let my positions become broken shape and I feel like I did a much better job at it. I'm still having problems of telling when I can move quicker vs a slower move, but thats probably going to take me awhile to work on. Just wanted to say I feel like all the advice you guys gave was very helpful

Boyce

I took the liberty of looking up this game. You played well. I'd advise that you spam a bunch of tsumego/tesuji problems so that you can get a better intuition about which plays work, and which don't. You defended a lot against things that don't work.

[Boyce]

Thanks Redundant! I'll go over that game and try to find some of those needless moves and begin doing a problems everyday. I have Tesuji by Davies and 1001 Life and Death problems so those should keep me busy for awhile I think.

Boyce