115 - robinz v. 1986

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robinz
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Re: 115 - robinz v. 1986

Post by robinz »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm185 Prisoner Count :w9: :b5:
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . X . X . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O X . . O X X X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O X . X X O O O O O O . |
$$ | . . . O . X . . . X X O O X X X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . . O X X O . . X X X |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . O . . O . O X . . X |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . X X X . |
$$ | . O X O O O O . . . . . . . X . X O X |
$$ | . O X X . X X X . . . . . X . X O O O |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , O . X X X X X O 1 |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . X O O O X O . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O O X X O O O O |
$$ | . . O . X X X X . X . . . O X O X O O |
$$ | . O O . X O O X O . . . . O X X X X O |
$$ | X X O X . . . O X X . . O . O X . X O |
$$ | . . X O O O . . O , . . . O O X O X X |
$$ | X X X O X O . . . . O . . O . O X X . |
$$ | . . . X X O . . . . . . . . . O X O X |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O O O |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]


Nothing much to say here that I didn't say in my last post...

In short: I'm about to lose the capturing race (unless 1986 deems it worth answering the ko threat I play next - almost certainly an atari on L15 - in which case I'll simply capture his group and accept losing something fairly big to a ko threat, as I still have H18), but am hoping to kill something fairly large in compensation, like his upper-right corner. I keep thinking things are about to settle down, but I doubt it - the gloves are definitely off now :rambo:
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1986
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Re: 115 - robinz v. 1986

Post by 1986 »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm186 Prisoner Count :w9: :b6:
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . X . X . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O X . . O X X X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O X . X X O O O O O O . |
$$ | . . . O . X . . . X X O O X X X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . . O X X O . . X X X |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . O . . O . O X . . X |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . X X X 1 |
$$ | . O X O O O O . . . . . . . X . X O . |
$$ | . O X X . X X X . . . . . X . X O O O |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , O . X X X X X O X |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . X O O O X O . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O O X X O O O O |
$$ | . . O . X X X X . X . . . O X O X O O |
$$ | . O O . X O O X O . . . . O X X X X O |
$$ | X X O X . . . O X X . . O . O X . X O |
$$ | . . X O O O . . O , . . . O O X O X X |
$$ | X X X O X O . . . . O . . O . O X X . |
$$ | . . . X X O . . . . . . . . . O X O X |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O O O |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]


see previous post
standing still means going backwards
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robinz
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Re: 115 - robinz v. 1986

Post by robinz »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm187 Prisoner Count :w9: :b6:
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . X . X . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O X . . O X X X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O X . X X O O O O O O . |
$$ | . . . O . X . . . X X O O X X X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . 1 O X X O . . X X X |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . O . . O . O X . . X |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O |
$$ | . O X O O O O . . . . . . . X . X O . |
$$ | . O X X . X X X . . . . . X . X O O O |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , O . X X X X X O X |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . X O O O X O . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O O X X O O O O |
$$ | . . O . X X X X . X . . . O X O X O O |
$$ | . O O . X O O X O . . . . O X X X X O |
$$ | X X O X . . . O X X . . O . O X . X O |
$$ | . . X O O O . . O , . . . O O X O X X |
$$ | X X X O X O . . . . O . . O . O X X . |
$$ | . . . X X O . . . . . . . . . O X O X |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O O O |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]


As already discussed.

I should say that, whatever the outcome here (and I'm well aware that I may well find myself having to resign once the dust has settled), I will have to thank my opponent for giving me one of the most enjoyable games of go I've ever had :D
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1986
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Re: 115 - robinz v. 1986

Post by 1986 »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm188 Prisoner Count :w9: :b8:
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . X . X . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O X . . O X X X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O X . X X O O O O O O . |
$$ | . . . O . X . . . X X O O X X X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . X O . . O . . X X X |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . O . 1 O . O X . . X |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O |
$$ | . O X O O O O . . . . . . . X . X O . |
$$ | . O X X . X X X . . . . . X . X O O O |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , O . X X X X X O X |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . X O O O X O . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O O X X O O O O |
$$ | . . O . X X X X . X . . . O X O X O O |
$$ | . O O . X O O X O . . . . O X X X X O |
$$ | X X O X . . . O X X . . O . O X . X O |
$$ | . . X O O O . . O , . . . O O X O X X |
$$ | X X X O X O . . . . O . . O . O X X . |
$$ | . . . X X O . . . . . . . . . O X O X |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O O O |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]


OK, back to the KO, i can handle at least one more KO because c2 is a unstoppable KO threat if he ignores i play b2 and kill the lower left corner, putting me in good position to fight for the win. as a matter of a fact i hope and pray he ignores c2 :D

right now ignoring here is a no no i can take the lower right corner yes, that would feel good but i will still be Significantly behind, besides if i take now my lower right group will be the only group that can safely enter the center, since I'm blocking and continuing the KO i have more options for the center
standing still means going backwards
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perceval
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Re: 115 - robinz v. 1986

Post by perceval »

rarely seen a game so intense :clap: ... because here we have strong players giving us "the solution" and we see them struggle and miss opportunities and then have a second chance ...
Here if i understand correctly W should have ignored and proceed with the ko
i must say i would not do much better i think this is really hard :blackeye:
In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice. In practice, there is.
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topazg
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Re: 115 - robinz v. 1986

Post by topazg »

Am I misreading?

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm188 Prisoner Count :w9: :b8:
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . X . X . O . . . . 5 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O X . 4 O X X X 3 . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O X . X X O O O O O O . |
$$ | . . . O . X . . . X X O O X X X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . X C X X O . . X X X |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . O 2 . O . O X . . X |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O |
$$ | . O X O O O O . . . . . . . X . X O . |
$$ | . O X X . X X X . . . . . X . X O O O |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , O . X X X X X O X |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . X O O O X O . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O O X X O O O O |
$$ | . . O . X X X X . X . . . O X O X O O |
$$ | . O O . X O O X O . . . . O X X X X O |
$$ | X X O X . . . O X X . . O . O X . X O |
$$ | . . X O O O . . O , . . . O O X O X X |
$$ | X X X O X O . . . . O . . O . O X X 1 |
$$ | . . . X X O . . . . . . . . . O X O C |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O O O |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]


This just seems to live for White?

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm193 Prisoner Count :w9: :b8:
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . X . X . O . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O X . X O X X X O . 2 1 |
$$ | . . . . O X . O X . X X O O O O O O . |
$$ | . . . O . X . . . X X O O X X X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . X . X X O . . X X X |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . O X . O . O X . . X |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O |
$$ | . O X O O O O . . . . . . . X . X O . |
$$ | . O X X . X X X . . . . . X . X O O O |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , O . X X X X X O X |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . X O O O X O . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O O X X O O O O |
$$ | . . O . X X X X . X . . . O X O X O O |
$$ | . O O . X O O X O . . . . O X X X X O |
$$ | X X O X . . . O X X . . O . O X . X O |
$$ | . . X O O O . . O , . . . O O X O X X |
$$ | X X X O X O . . . . O . . O . O X X O |
$$ | . . . X X O . . . . . . . . . O X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O O O |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm193 Prisoner Count :w9: :b8:
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . X . X . O . . . . O a . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O X . X O X X X O . 1 2 |
$$ | . . . . O X . O X . X X O O O O O O . |
$$ | . . . O . X . . . X X O O X X X X O b |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . X . X X O . . X X X |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . O X . O . O X . . X |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O |
$$ | . O X O O O O . . . . . . . X . X O . |
$$ | . O X X . X X X . . . . . X . X O O O |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , O . X X X X X O X |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . X O O O X O . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O O X X O O O O |
$$ | . . O . X X X X . X . . . O X O X O O |
$$ | . O O . X O O X O . . . . O X X X X O |
$$ | X X O X . . . O X X . . O . O X . X O |
$$ | . . X O O O . . O , . . . O O X O X X |
$$ | X X X O X O . . . . O . . O . O X X O |
$$ | . . . X X O . . . . . . . . . O X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O O O |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm193 Prisoner Count :w9: :b8:
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . X . X . O . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O X . X O X X X O . 2 . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O X . X X O O O O O O . |
$$ | . . . O . X . . . X X O O X X X X O 1 |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . X . X X O . . X X X |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . O X . O . O X . . X |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O |
$$ | . O X O O O O . . . . . . . X . X O . |
$$ | . O X X . X X X . . . . . X . X O O O |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , O . X X X X X O X |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . X O O O X O . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O O X X O O O O |
$$ | . . O . X X X X . X . . . O X O X O O |
$$ | . O O . X O O X O . . . . O X X X X O |
$$ | X X O X . . . O X X . . O . O X . X O |
$$ | . . X O O O . . O , . . . O O X O X X |
$$ | X X X O X O . . . . O . . O . O X X O |
$$ | . . . X X O . . . . . . . . . O X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O O O |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]


I think White capturing the ko has to be the only move.
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lefuet
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Re: 115 - robinz v. 1986

Post by lefuet »

topazg wrote:Am I misreading?

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm188 Prisoner Count :w9: :b8:
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . X . X . O . . . . 5 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O X . 4 O X X X 3 . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O X . X X O O O O O O . |
$$ | . . . O . X . . . X X O O X X X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . X C X X O . . X X X |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . O 2 . O . O X . . X |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O |
$$ | . O X O O O O . . . . . . . X . X O . |
$$ | . O X X . X X X . . . . . X . X O O O |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , O . X X X X X O X |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . X O O O X O . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O O X X O O O O |
$$ | . . O . X X X X . X . . . O X O X O O |
$$ | . O O . X O O X O . . . . O X X X X O |
$$ | X X O X . . . O X X . . O . O X . X O |
$$ | . . X O O O . . O , . . . O O X O X X |
$$ | X X X O X O . . . . O . . O . O X X 1 |
$$ | . . . X X O . . . . . . . . . O X O C |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O O O |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]


This just seems to live for White?

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm193 Prisoner Count :w9: :b8:
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . X . X . O . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O X . X O X X X O . 2 1 |
$$ | . . . . O X . O X . X X O O O O O O . |
$$ | . . . O . X . . . X X O O X X X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . X . X X O . . X X X |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . O X . O . O X . . X |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O |
$$ | . O X O O O O . . . . . . . X . X O . |
$$ | . O X X . X X X . . . . . X . X O O O |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , O . X X X X X O X |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . X O O O X O . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O O X X O O O O |
$$ | . . O . X X X X . X . . . O X O X O O |
$$ | . O O . X O O X O . . . . O X X X X O |
$$ | X X O X . . . O X X . . O . O X . X O |
$$ | . . X O O O . . O , . . . O O X O X X |
$$ | X X X O X O . . . . O . . O . O X X O |
$$ | . . . X X O . . . . . . . . . O X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O O O |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm193 Prisoner Count :w9: :b8:
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . X . X . O . . . . O a . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O X . X O X X X O . 1 2 |
$$ | . . . . O X . O X . X X O O O O O O . |
$$ | . . . O . X . . . X X O O X X X X O b |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . X . X X O . . X X X |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . O X . O . O X . . X |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O |
$$ | . O X O O O O . . . . . . . X . X O . |
$$ | . O X X . X X X . . . . . X . X O O O |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , O . X X X X X O X |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . X O O O X O . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O O X X O O O O |
$$ | . . O . X X X X . X . . . O X O X O O |
$$ | . O O . X O O X O . . . . O X X X X O |
$$ | X X O X . . . O X X . . O . O X . X O |
$$ | . . X O O O . . O , . . . O O X O X X |
$$ | X X X O X O . . . . O . . O . O X X O |
$$ | . . . X X O . . . . . . . . . O X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O O O |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm193 Prisoner Count :w9: :b8:
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . X . X . O . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O X . X O X X X O . 2 . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O X . X X O O O O O O . |
$$ | . . . O . X . . . X X O O X X X X O 1 |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . X . X X O . . X X X |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . O X . O . O X . . X |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O |
$$ | . O X O O O O . . . . . . . X . X O . |
$$ | . O X X . X X X . . . . . X . X O O O |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , O . X X X X X O X |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . X O O O X O . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O O X X O O O O |
$$ | . . O . X X X X . X . . . O X O X O O |
$$ | . O O . X O O X O . . . . O X X X X O |
$$ | X X O X . . . O X X . . O . O X . X O |
$$ | . . X O O O . . O , . . . O O X O X X |
$$ | X X X O X O . . . . O . . O . O X X O |
$$ | . . . X X O . . . . . . . . . O X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O O O |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]


I think White capturing the ko has to be the only move.

I think that you are correct that black needs another move to kill the UR corner. But white also needs another move to win the ko.
I've not really understood the situation myself yet. ..
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Koroviev
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Re: 115 - robinz v. 1986

Post by Koroviev »

I'm amazed W answered that ko threat. I would certainly have taken the ko, since it's rescuing a huge group that should defnintely have died. The top right corner looks unhealthy, but not terminal.
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robinz
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Re: 115 - robinz v. 1986

Post by robinz »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm189 Prisoner Count :w10: :b8:
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . X . X . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O X . . O X X X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O X . X X O O O O O O . |
$$ | . . . O . X . . . X X O O X X X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . X O . . O . . X X X |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . O . O O . O X . . X |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . X X X . |
$$ | . O X O O O O . . . . . . . X . X O 1 |
$$ | . O X X . X X X . . . . . X . X O O O |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , O . X X X X X O X |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . X O O O X O . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O O X X O O O O |
$$ | . . O . X X X X . X . . . O X O X O O |
$$ | . O O . X O O X O . . . . O X X X X O |
$$ | X X O X . . . O X X . . O . O X . X O |
$$ | . . X O O O . . O , . . . O O X O X X |
$$ | X X X O X O . . . . O . . O . O X X . |
$$ | . . . X X O . . . . . . . . . O X O X |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O O O |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]


OK, he's decided to answer - I've no idea if that's best or not (although I suspect it probably is). Next I plan to ignore any ko threat he plays, but I may waver when I see what it is...
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1986
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Re: 115 - robinz v. 1986

Post by 1986 »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm190 :w10: :b8:
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . X . X . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O X . . O X X X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O X . X X O O O O O O . |
$$ | . . . O . X . . . X X O O X X X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . X O . . O . . X X X |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . O . O O . O X . . X |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . X X X . |
$$ | . O X O O O O . . . . . . . X . X O X |
$$ | . O X X . X X X . . . . . X . X O O O |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , O . X X X X X O X |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . X O O O X O . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O O X X O O O O |
$$ | . . O . X X X X . X . . . O X O X O O |
$$ | . O O . X O O X O . . . . O X X X X O |
$$ | X X O X . . . O X X . . O . O X . X O |
$$ | . . X O O O . . O , . . . O O X O X X |
$$ | X X X O X O . . . . O . . O . O X X . |
$$ | . . 1 X X O . . . . . . . . . O X O X |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O O O |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]


see previous post.
standing still means going backwards
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jts
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Re: 115 - robinz v. 1986

Post by jts »

Can B still capture b6? b6 and b5 both have 5 liberties, but it seems like W will have to play the shared liberty to prevent a connection... I think it depend on what move W used to capture.
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Re: 115 - robinz v. 1986

Post by robinz »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm191 :w28: :b8:
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . X . X . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O X . . O X X X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O X . X X O O O O O O . |
$$ | . . . O . X . . . X X O O X X X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . X O . . O . . X X X |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . O . O O . O X . . X |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . X X X . |
$$ | . O X O O O O . . . . . . . X . X . X |
$$ | . O X X . X X X . . . . . X . X . . . |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , O . X X X X X . X |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . X . . . X . 1 |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O O X X . . . . |
$$ | . . O . X X X X . X . . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . O O . X O O X O . . . . O X X X X . |
$$ | X X O X . . . O X X . . O . O X . X . |
$$ | . . X O O O . . O , . . . O O X O X X |
$$ | X X X O X O . . . . O . . O . O X X . |
$$ | . . O X X O . . . . . . . . . O X O X |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O O O |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]


Yep, I expected as much - that's a big one. Or at least it appears to be - clearly the three D2 stones are gone, but that would be a small price to pay; he's clearly after killing the whole group (by playing B2 next), but after I play A2 (forcing him to make extra approach moves in the corner, and in sente) it's far from clear that I will lose the capturing race involving his C5 group. (Although I might well do - I've not read it in any detail yet.) Hmm, just what this game needs, another tight semeai, possibly involving a ko :shock:

I'm not giving it much thought yet, though, as responding to this ko threat just isn't an option - I have none left which really threaten to do much, so my last hope in this game is to win the ko and then try to minimise the damage I suffer in so doing.
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Re: 115 - robinz v. 1986

Post by Koroviev »

Looks like the right move from Black, to me. I wonder what strong players think.
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Re: 115 - robinz v. 1986

Post by topazg »

Koroviev wrote:
Looks like the right move from Black, to me. I wonder what strong players think.


I agree, and by my reading, all Black loses is 3 stones. Black may just be back in this game
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Re: 115 - robinz v. 1986

Post by xDragon »

topazg wrote:
Koroviev wrote:
Looks like the right move from Black, to me. I wonder what strong players think.


I agree, and by my reading, all Black loses is 3 stones. Black may just be back in this game


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm191 :w28: :b8:
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . X . X . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O X . . O X X X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . O X . X X O O O O O O . |
$$ | . . . O . X . . . X X O O X X X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O . X O . . O . . X X X |
$$ | . . O . O . . . . O . O O . O X . . X |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . X X X . |
$$ | . O X O O O O . . . . . . . X . X . X |
$$ | . O X X . X X X . . . . . X . X . . . |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , O . X X X X X . X |
$$ | . . X X X . . . . . . . X . . . X . 1 |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . O O X X . . . . |
$$ | . . O . X X X X . X . . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . O O . X O O X O . . . . O X X X X . |
$$ | X X O X . . . O X X . . O . O X . X . |
$$ | . . X O O O . . O , . . . O O X O X X |
$$ | X X X O X O . . . . O . . O . O X X . |
$$ | . 2 O X X O . . . . . . . . . O X O X |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O O O |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]


i dont see how b refutes this and has the corner live?
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