8k vs 8k

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Boyce
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8k vs 8k

Post by Boyce »

Hello everyone!
Its been awhile since I asked for any reviews so I was hoping you guys would be willing to look over this game for me. Last time I asked for a review it was pointed out that I was playing just a little fast (as in less than 5 seconds a move :oops: ). Since you guys pointed that out, I've worked at slowing down my game and actually thinking about my moves more. Not only did I improve, but I enjoy playing alot more too so I'm glad you guys gave me the advice last time. Right now I'm fluctuating between 6-8k and can't seem to really improve at all which may be due to my lack of playing time. My schoolwork takes up alot of time so I don't get to play a whole lot right now. I appreciate any advice you guys can give me on mistakes in this game :). Thanks!

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EdLee
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Post by EdLee »

Just a few ideas in the beginning. Mostly shape problems.
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Boyce
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Re: 8k vs 8k

Post by Boyce »

Yeah move 51 is kind of ridiculous :oops: . I meant to connect, but I got distracted by something else nearby and misclicked. I decided to just play it through since I figured it was my own fault. :-?
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tj86430
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Re: 8k vs 8k

Post by tj86430 »

Could someone more knowledgeable comment the upper right corner (move 201->)?
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EdLee
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Post by EdLee »

tj86430 wrote:upper right corner (move 201->)?
W 184 at Q19. B 201 at S19.
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cyclops
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Re:

Post by cyclops »

EdLee wrote:... B 201 at S19.
( :b1: in the diagram below )
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc the game
$$ --------------+
$$ . X O a 3 5 6 |
$$ . X O O . 4 . |
$$ . X X O O O 2 |
$$ . . X X X O 1 |
$$ . . . . X X . |
$$ . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . X X . |[/go]

After :b1: @S19 :w2: @R19 w lives with territory.
On the other hand in the diagram :w2:@S19 gives w easy life with territory.
Finally :w6: is a nice example of what might happen to you if you play in a Mannen Ko. If w had left the position alone he probably wouldn't have been killed and finally have lived in seki. Even then W258@a in the diagram position was plain suicide. If W258 had been a pass B had no choice but to pass and lose the game.

edit: I meant: Even then W256@a in the diagram position was plain suicide. If W256 had been a pass B had no choice but to pass and lose the game. ( But see later post )
Last edited by cyclops on Sat Nov 12, 2011 7:40 pm, edited 4 times in total.
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Bill Spight
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Re: 8k vs 8k

Post by Bill Spight »

tj86430 wrote:Could someone more knowledgeable comment the upper right corner (move 201->)?


This turned into a kind of 10,000 year ko.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B 10,000 year ko
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X X X O . 3 5 6 |
$$ | . . . . . O X . . . . X O O O O . 4 . |
$$ | . . . . . O X . X X X . X O X O O O 2 |
$$ | . . . O . O X X O X O X . X X X X O 1 |
$$ | O X O . . . O O O O O X . . . . X X 9 |
$$ | . O O O X O O . . O O O X . . X O . . |
$$ | . X O X O O X . O X X O X . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O X O X O O O X O O X . . . . X X |
$$ | . . X X O X X X O X X X X . . X . X O |
$$ | . . X , X . . X O X O O X X . , X O O |
$$ | . . . . . . . X O O O . O O X X X O X |
$$ | . . . . X X X X O X O O O . O X O O . |
$$ | . . . X O O O X O X X O X O O O . . . |
$$ | . . X O . O X X O O X X X X . O O . . |
$$ | . . X O . . O O O X . . . O . X O O . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O X X X X X . X X O 8 |
$$ | . . X O . X . O . O O X O X . . . X O |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . O O O X . . . X 7 |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


:w2: is a mistake, which :b3: capitalized upon. :) The result is a 10,000 year ko, which Black should initiate.

Where should :w2: be? There are three plausible candidates.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B White replies
$$ ----------------
$$ X X X O . . a . |
$$ X O O O O . b c |
$$ . X O X O O O . |
$$ X . X X X X O 1 |
$$ X . . . . X X . |
$$ O X . . X O . . |
$$ O X . . . . . . |
$$ O X . . . . X X |
$$ X X . . X . X O |[/go]


Each of "a", "b", and "c" leaves the same count, 6 points for White in the corner.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W 2-1
$$ ----------------
$$ X X X O . 8 1 . |
$$ X O O O O 9 6 7 |
$$ . X O X O O O 3 |
$$ X . X X X X O X |
$$ X . . . . X X 4 |
$$ O X . . X O . . |
$$ O X . . . . . . |
$$ O X . . . . X X |
$$ X X . . X . X O |[/go]


If White plays on this 2-1 point, later we figure that :w3: - :b4: is sente. Then Black has two ko threats in the corner.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W The other 2-1
$$ ----------------
$$ X X X O . 6 7 . |
$$ X O O O O 9 8 1 |
$$ . X O X O O O 3 |
$$ X . X X X X O X |
$$ X . . . . X X 4 |
$$ O X . . X O . . |
$$ O X . . . . . . |
$$ O X . . . . X X |
$$ X X . . X . X O |[/go]


If White plays on the other 2-1 point, Black also has two ko threats in the corner.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W 2-2
$$ ----------------
$$ X X X O . 6 7 . |
$$ X O O O O . 1 . |
$$ . X O X O O O 3 |
$$ X . X X X X O X |
$$ X . . . . X X 4 |
$$ O X . . X O . . |
$$ O X . . . . . . |
$$ O X . . . . X X |
$$ X X . . X . X O |[/go]


But if White plays on the 2-2 point, Black has only one ko threat in the corner. The 2-2 is the spot to play. :)

----

Earlier

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B Inside play
$$ ----------------
$$ X X X O . 1 3 . |
$$ X O O O O . 2 5 |
$$ . X O X O O O . |
$$ X . X X X X O 4 |
$$ X . . . . X X . |
$$ O X . . X O . . |
$$ O X . . . . . . |
$$ O X . . . . X X |
$$ X X . . X . X O |[/go]


:b1: would have been technically better as in this diagram. The result is seki. (White can make a ko, but that is normally bad.)
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Boyce
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Re: 8k vs 8k

Post by Boyce »

Thanks for that post Bill! I felt like my play in the upper right was pretty desperate as I knew I was behind. Lately my I seem to be playing pretty poorly. I was fortunate he answered my push at T16. The ko won me the game but only because it looks like he made some huge errors. Thank you for pointing out how to play the corner correctly on both our parts :)
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